Yes, Darkside, it seems prudent to set these boundaries when out of the liberating state that Peter is talking about. I have experienced what he says though, but only in limited situations. If you are not afraid of let's say your mother or something associated with her (some misbelief), it does not matter if you avoid her or not. She has 0 power over you, even if you talk to her every minute. I can not say I achieved the state of being completely fearless and open to everything. But I have tried to overcome a particular fear. For me, being able to identify and face fear is the most difficult thing to do. Overcoming fear opens up a lot of opportunities, some of them related to blending boundaries that we build before, when we were afraid. I think it takes a lot of effort, a lot of wisdom to realize and overcome some more complex, deeper fears. It is hard work.
- Thread starter David Baxter PhD
- Start date
Peter's comments draw a bit on perspectives that originally come from Eastern philosophy, that all egos, identities, and / or people (?) are illusions. Some perspectives that draw on Eastern / Buddhist philosophy are interesting, and I've found some modern authors that to me have simplified, popularised, and clarified some of these thoughts, such as Eckhart Tolle, somewhat useful.
When talking about some areas of life such as selfhood, toxic people, and toxic or dangerous situations, in my view the best result still can't be attained without self-protective boundary setting. I feel that the thoughts of Eastern philosophy, for most people, are likely to be best used as an adjunct or an augment to that.
I guess once nearing the guru stage, maybe the behaviour of these kind of people could be coped with.... Maybe not, though, because there'd be no time for the guruism or meditation or anything really, because all one's time and life would be filled with doing the bidding of these people, picking up their crazy phone calls, clearing one's answering machine, dealing with consequences and problems from having their behaviour in one's life, etc, etc.
Having said that, it's true that a plan to deal with and face some fears can be a great opportunity for growth and evolution.
When talking about some areas of life such as selfhood, toxic people, and toxic or dangerous situations, in my view the best result still can't be attained without self-protective boundary setting. I feel that the thoughts of Eastern philosophy, for most people, are likely to be best used as an adjunct or an augment to that.
I guess once nearing the guru stage, maybe the behaviour of these kind of people could be coped with.... Maybe not, though, because there'd be no time for the guruism or meditation or anything really, because all one's time and life would be filled with doing the bidding of these people, picking up their crazy phone calls, clearing one's answering machine, dealing with consequences and problems from having their behaviour in one's life, etc, etc.
Having said that, it's true that a plan to deal with and face some fears can be a great opportunity for growth and evolution.
You are right, it does not sound very realistic to exist in some guru stage of fearlessness forever.When talking about some areas of life such as selfhood, toxic people, and toxic or dangerous situations, in my view the best result still can't be attained without self-protective boundary setting. I feel that the thoughts of Eastern philosophy, for most people, are likely to be best used as an adjunct or an augment to that.
I guess once nearing the guru stage, maybe the behaviour of these kind of people could be coped with.... Maybe not, though, because there'd be no time for the guruism or meditation or anything really, because all one's time and life would be filled with doing the bidding of these people, picking up their crazy phone calls, clearing one's answering machine, dealing with consequences and problems from having their behaviour in one's life, etc, etc.
Having said that, it's true that a plan to deal with and face some fears can be a great opportunity for growth and evolution.
That is almost as achievable as living the "hatha yoga" life, i.e. meditating and staying hungry all day.
At the same time there is things to learn and apply from these philosophies.
In my humble opinion, I did face my fear. My fear that I had to accept my mother was never going to change. My fear that my father was going to support her and no one else. My fears of what would happen if I stayed in that toxic relationship with her, and my fears about what would happen if I left.
I faced the toughest one, for me: how it would be to have them be "dead" to me, and me feeling a bit like an orphan. I know in my HEAD she's never had any power over me, but now she has none. I felt in the past that I had to do things or I'd lose something, but now I don't have to worry about that.
Compared to how I USED to feel and how I feel NOW, that's like comparing Hell with Zen, if I can confuse the two cultures... lol
I faced the toughest one, for me: how it would be to have them be "dead" to me, and me feeling a bit like an orphan. I know in my HEAD she's never had any power over me, but now she has none. I felt in the past that I had to do things or I'd lose something, but now I don't have to worry about that.
Compared to how I USED to feel and how I feel NOW, that's like comparing Hell with Zen, if I can confuse the two cultures... lol
I don't think discussion about facing fears is even relevant here,unless it's fear of setting boundaries.
I'm starting to feel like it's being implied that if people just face their fears then boundaries aren't even necessary.But to me,facing your fears is the precise reason that boundaries are needed.
I'm starting to feel like it's being implied that if people just face their fears then boundaries aren't even necessary.But to me,facing your fears is the precise reason that boundaries are needed.
Peter
MVP
Hello jollygreenjellybean, PrincessX, and Darkside.
Thanking you for feedback.
Please see that some of my posts may paint a picture of what can be possible further up the road.
My personal experience has shown me that such pictures create further stepping stones to attain.
Then what is between me and 'what is attainable' are just stepping stones (mini-goals).
In doing so, my mini-goals become more doable. They became a means to an end, not an end in itself.
The original post, to this thread, explained many things and pointed to many ways to attaining your boundaries.
My intention was to inform that boundaries are movable and retractable, and not an end in itself.
But at first we need enough self-awareness and self-esteem to attain our boundaries, before we can start retracting them bit by bit.
It is much like knowing that the last stage of grief and loss is 'acceptance'. Knowing this, acceptance becomes the gateway to freedom.
Without knowing this, a person may get stuck, forever, in an earlier stage - such as anger, or blaming. And many have wasted away by doing so.
Once a person knows that acceptance is the goal, then they no longer feel to hang around the earlier stages any longer than necessary.
A similar thread was about building self-esteem. The idea is to build up enough self-esteem to a become less afraid to protect yourself, set down boundaries, and be more self-responsible.
These 'building self-esteem' experiences and laying down boundaries are necessary, but they are not necessarily the goal if one wishes further serenity and peace in their life.
The picture in this case is to build enough self-esteem to no longer need it.
Such pictures are expressed in the hope to helping anybody, who find themselves stuck in an earlier stage, to move on.
Thanking you for feedback.
Please see that some of my posts may paint a picture of what can be possible further up the road.
My personal experience has shown me that such pictures create further stepping stones to attain.
Then what is between me and 'what is attainable' are just stepping stones (mini-goals).
In doing so, my mini-goals become more doable. They became a means to an end, not an end in itself.
The original post, to this thread, explained many things and pointed to many ways to attaining your boundaries.
My intention was to inform that boundaries are movable and retractable, and not an end in itself.
But at first we need enough self-awareness and self-esteem to attain our boundaries, before we can start retracting them bit by bit.
It is much like knowing that the last stage of grief and loss is 'acceptance'. Knowing this, acceptance becomes the gateway to freedom.
Without knowing this, a person may get stuck, forever, in an earlier stage - such as anger, or blaming. And many have wasted away by doing so.
Once a person knows that acceptance is the goal, then they no longer feel to hang around the earlier stages any longer than necessary.
A similar thread was about building self-esteem. The idea is to build up enough self-esteem to a become less afraid to protect yourself, set down boundaries, and be more self-responsible.
These 'building self-esteem' experiences and laying down boundaries are necessary, but they are not necessarily the goal if one wishes further serenity and peace in their life.
The picture in this case is to build enough self-esteem to no longer need it.
Such pictures are expressed in the hope to helping anybody, who find themselves stuck in an earlier stage, to move on.
I am trying to figure this out, too, LIT. On some level I sort of get it, but I am not sure if I have the whole picture.
I am not a therapist, I have very little psychology in my education, save a class in high school and one in university. And a huge interest in it outside of a degree/education.
I did have to put up boundaries in order to face my fears. Maybe the fear for us is that we actually have to accept that we do have boundaries? lol I don't know. For some people, realizing they are a separate entity from someone else can be very upsetting. You know, the enmeshment. It's like you and your abuser are almost conjoined twins. Except for all the veins and organs intertwining from the mother (who is the parasite) to the host (which is the child) can almost consume the host, and therefore nearly kill the parasite.
Not in the physical sense, but the spiritual/mental/subconscious... Ya know? To simply pull away from all of that entanglement is really hard and painful. There's no such thing as fast and precision surgery for that. It has to happen a little bit at a time. It's nearly like severing part of yourself away from yourself, and both you and your parasite experience pain at every little separation. Snip snip. Slice slice. When the host separates, there is a feeling of emptiness, and "is this all there is?" Because the host is used to filling him/herself up with someone else.
However, at some point the host realizes fully what is going on. This is not a symbiotic relationship. The only one benefiting is the parasite. There is some point of no return, or an "A-HA!" moment. Then it's almost easy to tear the rest off like a bandaid. The host starts to heal and pull further away, lets himself/herself bleed, comes out the other side of the wound transformed. The parasite chases the host, scrambling desperately to get a hold once more, and although the host can sometimes be dragged back into the dysfunction, sometimes more than once, I've heard some people (including myself) learn better and there will be a last time.
I know this is not real (the parent/parasite and the child/host) at least not in the physical sense. But that is how it feels. And it runs deep.
At the point of complete isolation from the parasite, the host goes on to live life. Nothing to suck his/her life energy and happiness away, and feeling fearless.
The parasite either becomes bitter and turns inward, or looks for another suitable host.
I am not a therapist, I have very little psychology in my education, save a class in high school and one in university. And a huge interest in it outside of a degree/education.
I did have to put up boundaries in order to face my fears. Maybe the fear for us is that we actually have to accept that we do have boundaries? lol I don't know. For some people, realizing they are a separate entity from someone else can be very upsetting. You know, the enmeshment. It's like you and your abuser are almost conjoined twins. Except for all the veins and organs intertwining from the mother (who is the parasite) to the host (which is the child) can almost consume the host, and therefore nearly kill the parasite.
Not in the physical sense, but the spiritual/mental/subconscious... Ya know? To simply pull away from all of that entanglement is really hard and painful. There's no such thing as fast and precision surgery for that. It has to happen a little bit at a time. It's nearly like severing part of yourself away from yourself, and both you and your parasite experience pain at every little separation. Snip snip. Slice slice. When the host separates, there is a feeling of emptiness, and "is this all there is?" Because the host is used to filling him/herself up with someone else.
However, at some point the host realizes fully what is going on. This is not a symbiotic relationship. The only one benefiting is the parasite. There is some point of no return, or an "A-HA!" moment. Then it's almost easy to tear the rest off like a bandaid. The host starts to heal and pull further away, lets himself/herself bleed, comes out the other side of the wound transformed. The parasite chases the host, scrambling desperately to get a hold once more, and although the host can sometimes be dragged back into the dysfunction, sometimes more than once, I've heard some people (including myself) learn better and there will be a last time.
I know this is not real (the parent/parasite and the child/host) at least not in the physical sense. But that is how it feels. And it runs deep.
At the point of complete isolation from the parasite, the host goes on to live life. Nothing to suck his/her life energy and happiness away, and feeling fearless.
The parasite either becomes bitter and turns inward, or looks for another suitable host.
For me,I know that setting boundaries is a necessity in order to protect myself,and I know I have no choice but to stick with them.Not having boundaries or 'limited' ones is the main reason my life is so full of chaos and drama at the present moment.
This thread is very confusing.It was supposed to be helpful but now it no longer is.
This thread is very confusing.It was supposed to be helpful but now it no longer is.
Peter
MVP
Any form of tension is fear-based.
Drawing a line is a way of facing our fears, and it is necessary. However, the more fears we face, the boundary line gets redrawn many times and retracts over time.
As a person becomes more immune to unreal fears (what people say to us, threats, etc.) that person becomes more tolerant, forgiving, allowing, patient, loving, understanding, listening, etc.
All these things I have mentioned do not contain fears. They have been overcome.
The boundaries we first laid down no longer stand, but have, over time, been redrawn and diminishing.
Whoa...are you kidding me?Are you really saying what people say to us,threats,etc.,are 'unreal' fears?
Maybe for you they are 'unreal',but for me,they are very real fears,and I feel insulted that you would even say otherwise.
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I have too so I know it is possible but it also requires a pure heart, and we all bring distortions and bias into our relationships. But like Ghandi I believe that the way of truth and love never fails.
Peter's comments draw a bit on perspectives that originally come from Eastern philosophy, that all egos, identities, and / or people (?) are illusions. Some perspectives that draw on Eastern / Buddhist philosophy are interesting, and I've found some modern authors that to me have simplified, popularised, and clarified some of these thoughts, such as Eckhart Tolle, somewhat useful.
When talking about some areas of life such as selfhood, toxic people, and toxic or dangerous situations, in my view the best result still can't be attained without self-protective boundary setting. I feel that the thoughts of Eastern philosophy, for most people, are likely to be best used as an adjunct or an augment to that.
I guess once nearing the guru stage, maybe the behaviour of these kind of people could be coped with.... Maybe not, though, because there'd be no time for the guruism or meditation or anything really, because all one's time and life would be filled with doing the bidding of these people, picking up their crazy phone calls, clearing one's answering machine, dealing with consequences and problems from having their behaviour in one's life, etc, etc.
Having said that, it's true that a plan to deal with and face some fears can be a great opportunity for growth and evolution.
In the 70s and 80s I read Ram Dass, Fritz Perls, Carlos Castaneda and others. I was even in therapy once with a Psychiatrist (back when Psychiatrists did therapy) who used the Zen/Buddhist model in his counseling. I tried living this way but found it too difficult to give up attachments and live in and participate in the world around me. In 2009 I landed in an outpatient facility for 2 weeks where I learned about DBT for the first time. (Marsha Linehan) We spent an entire day practicing the skill of self observation and the "wise mind." Something clicked and I began to rethink some things.
I have always believed that evil is a real force and not an illusion or a projection of humans. I've always believed that evil would exist as an external reality even in the absence of man. But in recent years I've begun to wonder if that is really true. There is a great little book written in the early 1970s by a lady by the name of Elizabeth O'Connor called, "Our Many Selves." She doesn't argue whether evil and good are opposing forces but rather she uses her book to point out how much the world can change when people change.
One of the things that has changed about me in recent years is that I no longer believe that the world is purely black or white or that things (and people) are either good or bad. There are a lot of shades of gray.
Peter
MVP
jollygreenjellybean, what you wrote in post #28 is very well said.
It is hard and painful, and it takes time.
I am now 60 y.o. and have been facing my truth for all those years, and it is never-ending. But it gets easier and easier.
Recover from hell works if you work it.
Without working at recover, we won't know how hard, painful, and time it takes.
Yet all those that do work it develop a life of gratitude for their new found freedom.
Is it worth it?
Imagine serenity at will.
---------- Post Merged at 11:15 AM ---------- Previous Post was at 11:13 AM ----------
Hello Lost_In_Thought
I am sorry you have felt insulted by what I have written. Please let my explain further about unreal fears, it may help to lessen the felt insult.
What people say are just words which we interpret. It is our interpretation which causes the fears in us. Not what is said.
Words are sound waves from a persons mouth which our ears pick up and send to the brain. It is our mind, and our collection of beliefs, that censor, label and place meaning to those sound waves.
It is OUR interpretations (by our beliefs) which determines a threat to our ego or not. This threat is our fears.
What a person may say, comes from their opinion. All is opinion, including this post. It is OUR mind that determines if we accept the opinion or not.
There is an old saying: Our focus determines our reality.
If we do not like our reality, we do have the power to change our focus (our interpretation to a more positive one).
The difference between a real and unreal fear:
A real fear is considered to be one where our life is in direct danger, such as walking across a street and about to get hit by a car.
An unreal fear is one that is not necessarily so, but imagined. In some cases it might happen, but at the time it has not, or it is not necessarily going to happen.
It is well known that at least 70% of our fears are unreal.
It is hard and painful, and it takes time.
I am now 60 y.o. and have been facing my truth for all those years, and it is never-ending. But it gets easier and easier.
Recover from hell works if you work it.
Without working at recover, we won't know how hard, painful, and time it takes.
Yet all those that do work it develop a life of gratitude for their new found freedom.
Is it worth it?
Imagine serenity at will.
---------- Post Merged at 11:15 AM ---------- Previous Post was at 11:13 AM ----------
Hello Lost_In_Thought
I am sorry you have felt insulted by what I have written. Please let my explain further about unreal fears, it may help to lessen the felt insult.
What people say are just words which we interpret. It is our interpretation which causes the fears in us. Not what is said.
Words are sound waves from a persons mouth which our ears pick up and send to the brain. It is our mind, and our collection of beliefs, that censor, label and place meaning to those sound waves.
It is OUR interpretations (by our beliefs) which determines a threat to our ego or not. This threat is our fears.
What a person may say, comes from their opinion. All is opinion, including this post. It is OUR mind that determines if we accept the opinion or not.
There is an old saying: Our focus determines our reality.
If we do not like our reality, we do have the power to change our focus (our interpretation to a more positive one).
The difference between a real and unreal fear:
A real fear is considered to be one where our life is in direct danger, such as walking across a street and about to get hit by a car.
An unreal fear is one that is not necessarily so, but imagined. In some cases it might happen, but at the time it has not, or it is not necessarily going to happen.
It is well known that at least 70% of our fears are unreal.
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Peter, the only thing I would add is that a lot of people here have suffered physical and sexual abuse as children. Those are more than just words to a child. Those are real boundaries which humanity and decency entitle us - especially as children. The fear and confusion with no means to protect ourselves (bodies and mind) is a direct result of a violation of those boundaries and have led many of us to believe we have no right to our own bodies or to our own souls.
I was also going to point out the sheer volume of work by reputable therapists and psychologists on the entire notion of boundaries made it clear that it is a legitimate concept which helps people sort out relationship issues and learn that they do have the right to be free from that kind of abuse. But that doesn't mean there isn't a better way. In fact, the notion of boundaries may have been so thoroughly consumerized that no one has stopped to think where we go from here. Perhaps boundaries are just a waypoint - a signpost along the road.
The bottom line for me is that people did me harm as a child and there are plenty of bad people out there in the world who would do me harm now if I am not vigilant. I can't change someone's nature just because I have overcome my attachment to fear.
I was also going to point out the sheer volume of work by reputable therapists and psychologists on the entire notion of boundaries made it clear that it is a legitimate concept which helps people sort out relationship issues and learn that they do have the right to be free from that kind of abuse. But that doesn't mean there isn't a better way. In fact, the notion of boundaries may have been so thoroughly consumerized that no one has stopped to think where we go from here. Perhaps boundaries are just a waypoint - a signpost along the road.
The bottom line for me is that people did me harm as a child and there are plenty of bad people out there in the world who would do me harm now if I am not vigilant. I can't change someone's nature just because I have overcome my attachment to fear.
Oh, okay, I understand that now. I was confused also.
That part where you explained what you meant about a real fear and an unreal fear...
I know a part of my relationship with my parents was based on real fear, and some was based on unreal fear. I do know that when I was a child, I had very little control, and then when I became an adult, I was still controlled by the now unreal fear that I still had no control. That might be simplifying things, but there were also still some issues where, perhaps not always fear, but definitely caution, played an integral part in that relationship, because there were some real dangers.
The thing is, my parents/mother's word (in her mind) was law, and to have one's own opinion, to her was a threat. A threat that I was going "against" her, rather than just being my own self, which I am supposed to do. A threat that I hated her, rejected her, or didn't want to be with her. So because of this "unreal" fear, she could do something that could instill "real fear" because, she was unpredictable and could do some "real damage." Not so much physical damage when I became an adult, but something financially devastating, something taken away from you that you really need, etc. Or at least she would try. Her favourite game was withholding affection. Is that not a "real fear," at least when we are children? At least as an adult we can learn better to love ourselves, and it will become an "unreal fear." Withholding affection: taking you out of the will, not speaking to her grandchildren, or worse... Vengeance: calling social services and making false reports that you are a bad mother, threatening to take your child away from you, threatening to evict you, somehow making other family members believe that you are a bad daughter, etc...
Anyways, there might be some grey area between what is a real fear and what is an unreal fear, then. I am still not 100% sure I understand what you mean. But I know you meant well.
That part where you explained what you meant about a real fear and an unreal fear...
I know a part of my relationship with my parents was based on real fear, and some was based on unreal fear. I do know that when I was a child, I had very little control, and then when I became an adult, I was still controlled by the now unreal fear that I still had no control. That might be simplifying things, but there were also still some issues where, perhaps not always fear, but definitely caution, played an integral part in that relationship, because there were some real dangers.
The thing is, my parents/mother's word (in her mind) was law, and to have one's own opinion, to her was a threat. A threat that I was going "against" her, rather than just being my own self, which I am supposed to do. A threat that I hated her, rejected her, or didn't want to be with her. So because of this "unreal" fear, she could do something that could instill "real fear" because, she was unpredictable and could do some "real damage." Not so much physical damage when I became an adult, but something financially devastating, something taken away from you that you really need, etc. Or at least she would try. Her favourite game was withholding affection. Is that not a "real fear," at least when we are children? At least as an adult we can learn better to love ourselves, and it will become an "unreal fear." Withholding affection: taking you out of the will, not speaking to her grandchildren, or worse... Vengeance: calling social services and making false reports that you are a bad mother, threatening to take your child away from you, threatening to evict you, somehow making other family members believe that you are a bad daughter, etc...
Anyways, there might be some grey area between what is a real fear and what is an unreal fear, then. I am still not 100% sure I understand what you mean. But I know you meant well.
The thoughts in psychology and philosophy about being careful of interpretations are valid.
However there is also the concept of abuse and abusive people, or invasion of another's rights. These things are outside of the realm of 'interpretation' and of 'nothing can hurt me if I am enlightened enough'.
There are people with intent to use us or harm us. They can and will, if a boundary is not carefully put and kept between us and certain people or certain behaviour.
If someone believes otherwise, they may not have had to be vigilant against the situation of being used by one of these people recently.
---
I guess it can be a precarious topic where care must be taken, on a psychology and mental health forum where there will be many who have had to spend literally years in therapy to be able to accept and understand the important concept of boundaries, and that they were used and abused, while their lying abusers told them the whole time "you are misinterpreting", "you're being selfish", etc.
Boundaries are the way forward in lots of situations, and in many cases certain boundaries must stay in place and not be removed.
However there is also the concept of abuse and abusive people, or invasion of another's rights. These things are outside of the realm of 'interpretation' and of 'nothing can hurt me if I am enlightened enough'.
There are people with intent to use us or harm us. They can and will, if a boundary is not carefully put and kept between us and certain people or certain behaviour.
If someone believes otherwise, they may not have had to be vigilant against the situation of being used by one of these people recently.
---
I guess it can be a precarious topic where care must be taken, on a psychology and mental health forum where there will be many who have had to spend literally years in therapy to be able to accept and understand the important concept of boundaries, and that they were used and abused, while their lying abusers told them the whole time "you are misinterpreting", "you're being selfish", etc.
Boundaries are the way forward in lots of situations, and in many cases certain boundaries must stay in place and not be removed.
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Peter
MVP
Thanks Darkside and jollygreenjellybean. Very good and valid responses.
Please let me tell you a bit about myself.
My childhood also contains sexual and physical abuse. Mentally, I was a nervous wreck. At school I was regarded as the class idiot. After I left home I became addict-alcoholic for 16 years. Throughout those years are volumes of stories and experiences I would not wish on my old enemies - not even my father.
At the age of 34 I was close to alcoholic death from internal hemorrhaging. I had two options, continue on self-sabotage or recover. I opted for recovery.
It was hard to change a lifetime of being a certain way. All my beliefs, philosophies of life, were twisted to support a life that just wanted to die. Recovery (to live) was foreign to me, and full of fear.
But if I wanted to live, I had no choice but to face my fears. I had a lot of help, and still do, from self-help groups and people like myself in recovery - just like yourselves.
For me, the main part of recovery was to learn the truth behind my life experiences.
First I had to trust and accept help from others.
Then be ruthfully honest to myself, and to those I trusted. This helped me to accept myself fully (abused, alcoholic, using others for self gain, etc, etc.)
Then I had to learn to change everything around that was twisted and untrue in me (not others).
From such self-honesty and changes in self, I was able to see the truth in others, including the insanity of my abusers.
Through similar identification of my own insanity, with others, I was able to forgive and let go of them. This took many years of recovery to fully understand and accept.
I have been changing and improving ever since I was thirty four.
In between those 26 years of recovery I went back to school. Gained a pass into university. Gained a degree in counselling. worked as a counsellor for ever since.
I know from experience that people can overcome adversities and change from a seemingly hopeless state of mind to one of good use to self and others.
As a good friend of mine says: "My life is not the old one polished up, but a brand new one beyond my imaginings of my past."
We can change if we are willing to work at it. (knowledge is the beginning of change, not the end).
Change takes practice, simulation, experimentation, prayer, trusting, taking a risk, facing our fears, etc.
If nothing changes, nothing changes. It is totally up to ourselves. Nobody can do it for us.
If we want it bad enough, we will do the work that is required for change.
My serenity is my measure of growth (change) in my life.
---------- Post Merged at 03:51 PM ---------- Previous Post was at 03:25 PM ----------
Sorry to have assumed others would understand my posts. Please forgive my intrusion.
Please let me tell you a bit about myself.
My childhood also contains sexual and physical abuse. Mentally, I was a nervous wreck. At school I was regarded as the class idiot. After I left home I became addict-alcoholic for 16 years. Throughout those years are volumes of stories and experiences I would not wish on my old enemies - not even my father.
At the age of 34 I was close to alcoholic death from internal hemorrhaging. I had two options, continue on self-sabotage or recover. I opted for recovery.
It was hard to change a lifetime of being a certain way. All my beliefs, philosophies of life, were twisted to support a life that just wanted to die. Recovery (to live) was foreign to me, and full of fear.
But if I wanted to live, I had no choice but to face my fears. I had a lot of help, and still do, from self-help groups and people like myself in recovery - just like yourselves.
For me, the main part of recovery was to learn the truth behind my life experiences.
First I had to trust and accept help from others.
Then be ruthfully honest to myself, and to those I trusted. This helped me to accept myself fully (abused, alcoholic, using others for self gain, etc, etc.)
Then I had to learn to change everything around that was twisted and untrue in me (not others).
From such self-honesty and changes in self, I was able to see the truth in others, including the insanity of my abusers.
Through similar identification of my own insanity, with others, I was able to forgive and let go of them. This took many years of recovery to fully understand and accept.
I have been changing and improving ever since I was thirty four.
In between those 26 years of recovery I went back to school. Gained a pass into university. Gained a degree in counselling. worked as a counsellor for ever since.
I know from experience that people can overcome adversities and change from a seemingly hopeless state of mind to one of good use to self and others.
As a good friend of mine says: "My life is not the old one polished up, but a brand new one beyond my imaginings of my past."
We can change if we are willing to work at it. (knowledge is the beginning of change, not the end).
Change takes practice, simulation, experimentation, prayer, trusting, taking a risk, facing our fears, etc.
If nothing changes, nothing changes. It is totally up to ourselves. Nobody can do it for us.
If we want it bad enough, we will do the work that is required for change.
My serenity is my measure of growth (change) in my life.
---------- Post Merged at 03:51 PM ---------- Previous Post was at 03:25 PM ----------
I agree with you. I still have boundaries that are for self protection, especially for physical abuse.
Sorry to have assumed others would understand my posts. Please forgive my intrusion.
No problem, thanks for clarifying your thoughts, Peter
Perfectly said Peter! You have stated the changes that I had to put into place to make my life my own. Even though my life is not "polished" I am content with the life I lead now. When life becomes crazy, I check in with myself first to figure out what I've let lapse. Often I've allowed someone to step over a boundary in my effort to rescue them - I'm a great rescuer
. The changes then begin with me to reestablish my feelings of serenity.
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