Weird Story of the Day

[David Baxter PhD]

Man bites dog biting dog
CBC News
Monday, September 28, 2009

It's a true-to-life case of man bites dog.

A Saskatoon man says he unleashed his inner canine in order to stop a wandering pit bull terrier from attacking his neighbour's dog about two weeks ago.

In a Sept. 24 interview, Jonathon Schacher said he heard a scream outside his home and looked outside to see the pit bull and the other dog entangled.

He said he ran outside and tried to pull the aggressive dog off the other, but the pit bull had its jaw locked around his neighbour dog's muzzle.

He tried yanking the pit bull off, but Schacher said that didn't work.

Trying to pry its jaw open didn't work either.

"I could just feel I needed to so something, and so I bit the dog right on the nose," he said.

He said the pit bull yelped in pain and he was able to pull on its jowls to give up his attack on the other animal.

Amazingly, the pit bull turned meek, Schacher said.

"He just sat down and his tail started wagging, and then I let go of him." But that's not all. Schacher said the dog licked him on the face, seemingly in supplication.

Schacher's neighbour told CBC News the pit bull left the neighbourhood following the incident.

 

[Banned]

I really don't like how they identify breeds in bite cases. All we hear about are the pitbulls, Rottweillers, and Dobermans, but statistically, mixed breeds deliver far more bites per year than purebreds. Plus, what most people don't realize is that "pitbull" is a generic word that applies to numerous dogs within the terrier family - American Staffordshire Terriers, Bull Terriers, American Bulldog, and others.

*End of dog-trainer rant*

 

[Jazzey]

Every pit bull I've ever encountered has always been very affectionate. Turtle, do you think that has to do with how they're trained maybe?

 

[Banned]

"Way back when" they were trained to fight to the death in the pits. And, as we know from the Michael Vick horrors, that still occurs today, sadly.

However, every breed of dog has the potential to be aggressive and deadly. While we can attribute a very small portion of that potential to breeding and genetics, certainly proper training and socialization will go miles in ensuring a well-rounded and happy dog.

Part of the problem, I think, is the stereotypes of the type of people that get pitties - the big tough macho man that wants a protector dog.

Dogs are great fodder for the whole nature vs nurture debate.

There are so many variables that make a dog a great pet. There are just as many variables that make the dog a liability.

 

[Banned]

Also, I've had lots of pitties come through my classes and have never had a problem. The dogs I've had to ask to leave are the Jack Russells, the Heelers, and a couple Shepherds.

 

[David Baxter PhD]

HA-HA-HA!

I love that AdSense Bot. In case you missed it, I'm typing this reply below a Google ad that says, "Sick of your dog's BEHAVIOR PROBLEMS? Aggression? Whining? Chewing? click here"

Getting back to pit bulls, I think a lot of them are either Jehovah's Witnesses or in the NDP...

 

[NicNak]

Turtle mentioned, the Jack Russels, I have met were more vicious (in my opinion) than any "Pitbull" or Rottie, that I have ever came across.

The "Pitbulls", larger breed bull terriors, and Rotties I have met would drown someone with slobbery wet, kisses before biting someone.

 

[David Baxter PhD]

The "Pitbulls", larger breed bull terriors, and Rotties I have met would drown someone with slobbery wet, kisses before biting someone.

The problem is not that they are always aggressive or that they're never affectionate. The problem is that certain breeds were selectively bred for aggression and they are unpredictable. You never know when those slobbery wet kisses are going to turn to bloody jaws clamped like a vise on your face.

 

[Andy]

LOL There are so many things wrong with this story. lol

First of all I wonder which one of the dogs developed the ability to scream? I suppose that would attract more attention than a plain old "woof".

What kind of stupid pills did this man take? Why would you put your face down towards an aggressive dogs face? A lot of people are getting plastic surgery these days but this is just going to far.

Of course last of all. Why would you put your face in a previously aggressive dogs face, after you have bitten him, to get some kisses?

Where is that Darwin award?

 

[Banned]

I think he's definitely a candidate for a future Darwin award, STP.

I work with dogs professionally, all day, every day. I don't put my face in any dogs face. And these are dogs I know. It's just dumb on so many levels. If the guy had gotten nailed, or the dog redirected his bite to dude's face, well, he totally would have deserved it and I would be lacking in the sympathy department.

 

[Eye Stigmata]

I agree with all of Turtle's statements...

And I also think too that it's not right to put a stereotype on certain breeds...I think when it really comes down to it, any canine regardless of size, breed, training etc, will/can react right down to their canine roots...where I'm going with this is : Let's say a Rotti reacts out of fear and bites someone...due to whatever circumstance, people will respond and say...oh well no wonder, it's a Rotti. But if the exact same scenario happens and it's a Golden Ret or Lab, people will say, WOW that's so out of character blah blah blah. Whereas I think both dogs could have reacted based on uncontrolled instant responses.
It's peoples attitudes/judgements behind so much of this "breed blaming"....

Uh...sorry if none of that made sense...I'm tired.....but It made sense in my head...lol

 

[David Baxter PhD]

I agree with all of Turtle's statements...

And I also think too that it's not right to put a stereotype on certain breeds...I think when it really comes down to it, any canine regardless of size, breed, training etc, will/can react right down to their canine roots...where I'm going with this is : Let's say a Rotti reacts out of fear and bites someone...due to whatever circumstance, people will respond and say...oh well no wonder, it's a Rotti. But if the exact same scenario happens and it's a Golden Ret or Lab, people will say, WOW that's so out of character blah blah blah. Whereas I think both dogs could have reacted based on uncontrolled instant responses.
It's peoples attitudes/judgements behind so much of this "breed blaming"....

Uh...sorry if none of that made sense...I'm tired.....but It made sense in my head...lol

And I have to disagree with it.

Of course, given the right circumstances, any dog can become aggressive, just as any human can become aggressive given the right combination of circumstances.

But as I said above, certain breeds are far more likely to attack and to do so unpredictably, without warning, because they have been deliberately and selectively bred over the years for exactly those characteristics. To deny that seems foolish to me.

Greyhounds were built to run. Would you deny that they exhibit those traits? Other dogs were bred specifically for hunting, pointing, retrieving, etc. They exhibit those traits. They do so because they are genetically predisposed to do so through selective breeding.

Some dogs

 

[Eye Stigmata]

I'm not pinning this down to certain breeds, all I'm saying is that any dog in the world has the potential...ANY potential to react... I'm not getting into statistics of which or what dogs are more or less likely. I was just saying that....any dog has the potential to react, but PEOPLE assume that just because one "Rotti" attacks that suddenly it means all Rotti's are 'aggressive' 'vicious', and whatever else - Thus leading to breed stereotypes...
Geez - Look at what's happened in so many cites. Ontario has an all Pitbull ban....New Brunswick passed a Law, banning Pitbulls, AM Bull Terries, Rotti's and Akita's. It's totally ridiculous...

 

[David Baxter PhD]

I'm not pinning this down to certain breeds, all I'm saying is that any dog in the world has the potential...ANY potential to react... I'm not getting into statistics of which or what dogs are more or less likely.

But that's just dodging the issue. The facts are as I stated: Those breeds that were intentionally and systematically bred for aggression are statistically more likely to attack and are responsible for a high proportion of all attacks by dogs.

I was just saying that....any dog has the potential to react, but PEOPLE assume that just because one "Rotti" attacks that suddenly it means all Rotti's are 'aggressive' 'vicious', and whatever else - Thus leading to breed stereotypes...

They are not just stereotypes. They were bred for that purpose.

Look at what's happened in so many cites. Ontario has an all Pitbull ban....New Brunswick passed a Law, banning Pitbulls, AM Bull Terries, Rotti's and Akita's. It's totally ridiculous...

Not at all. There's a reason they've banned those breeds. Research the statistics on dog attacks.

 

[David Baxter PhD]

DOG BITE LAW - Statistics about dog bites in the USA and elsewhere

The deadliest dogs
Merritt Clifton, editor of Animal People, has conducted an unusually detailed study of dog bites from 1982 to the present. (Clifton, Dog attack deaths and maimings, U.S. & Canada, September 1982 to November 13, 2006; click here to read it .) The Clifton study show the number of serious canine-inflicted injuries by breed. The author's observations about the breeds and generally how to deal with the dangerous dog problem are enlightening.

According to the Clifton study, pit bulls, Rottweilers, Presa Canarios and their mixes are responsible for 74% of attacks that were included in the study, 68% of the attacks upon children, 82% of the attacks upon adults, 65% of the deaths, and 68% of the maimings. In more than two-thirds of the cases included in the study, the life-threatening or fatal attack was apparently the first known dangerous behavior by the animal in question. Clifton states:

If almost any other dog has a bad moment, someone may get bitten, but will not be maimed for life or killed, and the actuarial risk is accordingly reasonable. If a pit bull terrier or a Rottweiler has a bad moment, often someone is maimed or killed--and that has now created off-the-chart actuarial risk, for which the dogs as well as their victims are paying the price. ​

Clifton's opinions are as interesting as his statistics. For example, he says, "Pit bulls and Rottweilers are accordingly dogs who not only must be handled with special precautions, but also must be regulated with special requirements appropriate to the risk they may pose to the public and other animals, if they are to be kept at all."

Dog attack - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

A study by Merritt Clifton, which analyzed serious attacks in the U.S. and Canada between 1982 and 2006, determined that Pit Bulls, Rottweilers, Presa Canarios, and their mixes were responsible for 74% of attacks studied and 65% of fatalities.[6][7] Another study indicates that pit bulls and their mixes were involved in approximately one third of the reported human dog bite-related fatalities between 1981 and 1992, while Rottweilers were responsible for about half of those fatalities reported between 1993 and 1996. [7]

Due to the pit bull-type breeds' perceived aggression, owning such an animal is not allowed in many European and Australasian countries and in several US and Canadian localities (see breed-specific legislation for details).

Dog Bite Statistics - DogsBite.org

Dog bite deaths and maimings US and Canada (1982-2007)
By compiling US and Canadian press accounts between 1982 and 2007, Animal People News determined the types of breeds most responsible for death and serious injury.
The combination of pit bulls, rottweilers and wolf hybrids:

• 77% of attacks that induce bodily harm
• 73% of attacks to children
• 83% of attack to adults
• 70% of attacks that result in fatalities
• 77% that result in maiming

Interesting fact about pit bulls:

• Pit bulls attack adults nearly as often as they attack children, a characteristic not found in any other breed.

Dog bite fatalites in the US (1979-1998)
Researchers reviewed a 20-year period from 1979 to 1998 to determine the types of breeds most responsible for US dog bite fatalities.

• At least 25 breeds of dogs were involved in 238 human dog bite related fatalities during this time span. Pit bulls and rottweilers were involved in over half of these fatalities and from 1997-1998, over 60%.
• Researchers note that it is extremely unlikely that pit bulls and rottweilers accounted for 60% of dogs in US households during this period thus, there appeared to be a breed-specific problem with fatalities.

 

[Banned]

Some of you may remember that many, many years ago, Dobermans were *the* breed to avoid. They were known for their aggression. They didn't even look nice, with their cropped ears and strong demeanour.

Breeders were breeding for aggression at that point.

It became such a problem, that the kennel clubs (that award championship titles on dogs) changed their breed standard for the Doberman to state that a Doberman showing ANY sign of aggression is to be immediately excused.

What happened? Breeders had to start breeding for temperament, as well as looks. Today, the Doberman is one of the friendliest breeds around, and are known to be great family dogs.

There will always be puppy mills and backyard breeders who sadly, are still breeding the wrong dogs for the wrong reasons, and letting them go to the wrong homes. Its those dogs who make a bad name for the entire breed.

I'm not in favour of breed-specific legislation, which is the hot topic in the dog world. I *am*, however, in favour of putting more efford into ending puppy mills and backyard breeders, where the majority of the "bad dogs" come from. And, potential homes for the "bully breeds" need to be screened much, much better to ensure the dogs go to proper homes. But of course, puppy mills and backyard breeders don't care where their dogs go, as long as the person on their doorstep can pay for the dog.

<sigh>...

 

[Jackie]

Getting back to pit bulls, I think a lot of them are either Jehovah's Witnesses or in the NDP...

Whats NDP? For some reason I thought of NLP

Never had trouble with pitbulls or staffs or anything, everyone I know with these dogs have dogs that are sweeties and very affection. I think its down to the way you treat them.

 

[David Baxter PhD]

Whats NDP? For some reason I thought of NLP

A Canadian political party.

Never had trouble with pitbulls or staffs or anything, everyone I know with these dogs have dogs that are sweeties and very affection. I think its down to the way you treat them.

No, not entirely. See the statistics above.

 

[Jazzey]

And I have to disagree with it.

Of course, given the right circumstances, any dog can become aggressive, just as any human can become aggressive given the right combination of circumstances.

But as I said above, certain breeds are far more likely to attack and to do so unpredictably, without warning, because they have been deliberately and selectively bred over the years for exactly those characteristics. To deny that seems foolish to me.

Greyhounds were built to run. Would you deny that they exhibit those traits? Other dogs were bred specifically for hunting, pointing, retrieving, etc. They exhibit those traits. They do so because they are genetically predisposed to do so through selective breeding.

Some dogs

And unfortunately, with pure-breads, you have to be careful about not too much in-breading. A few years ago I purchased a beautiful pure-bread. Unfortunately, he was extremely aggressive. Even with me. I eventually had to put him down after the veterinarian told me that, because of the in-breading, there was nothing to do with him - no amount of training was going to solve his aggression problems.

That's why now I really promote getting dogs at the local pound.

Darn...now I want a dog.

 

[Banned]

There is a bite assessment scale that determines how bad of a biter your dog is.

Level one - growling and air snaps
Level two - skin contact, bruising, no breakage of skin
Level three - breaking of the skin, less than 1/2 the depth of the canines, no tearing
Level four - breaking of the skin, deeper than 1/2 the depth of the canines, tearing of the skin
Level five - severe injury, multiple bites, multiple tears
Level six - the bite or attack caused the death of a person or animal

It's pretty much generally accepted by anyone who knows anything about aggression that pretty much a level four or higher is considered non-rehabilitable. A level three or under can usually be worked with and changed around to a certain extent. After level four, anyone with a brain will recommend euthanasia as the prognosis is extremely poor.