Getting Over a Narcissistic Mother

[H011yHawkJ311yBean]

I hear you loud and clear!

I'm sorry to hear your son got a drive-by Narcissistic brow-beating... So annoying that one has to constantly be on the lookout for low-flying Narcissists on their flying brooms...

Yeah I hear lots of parents saying they worry their kids won't have grandparents, but those aren't real "grandparents" (the better to EAT you with my dear)...

I don't have kids, but if I did, I would probably tell them (sounds like you did already) that staying away from gramma/grampa is to protect them/kids/family, not to punish them. Being with someone who is sick and refuses to change/get help isn't healthy and other people need to distance themselves. It's so hard sometimes trying to balance what is "enabling" and what is "support" or "empathy" when it comes to my mom... It's like she senses that because I feel bad for her (I used to pity her and felt it was my duty/obligation to still have a civil connection if not a meaningful and loving one) that it makes me vulnerable to her attacks. Nothing I can do for her. She chooses to be the way she is and I'm letting her, but I sure as heck don't have to be a part of it! lol

Did I post this already? Is God Really Telling Us To Honor Abusive Parents ? I like it because my mom always used to try throwing religion in my face, but of course Narcissists like to twist the truth just the tiniest bit with perception so that of course any and all things somehow always to bend to their favour...

*hugs*

 

[Frazzled]

Yes, religion is my mother's favorite weapon of choice. She keeps telling me "I'm not going to lose my soul because of this". I seriously doubt that the purpose of religion is for her to use as a weapon. My son has not been able to deal with her for a while and she sure has claimed him as collateral damage. He's loyal to his parents and that makes him fair game to her. I used to worry about what the rest of the family thought and now it's getting easier to not care. I don't need to be a part of a family that is like that. I do believe there may be a few narcissists among them but my mother is the most malignant. She's a peach. I have to say that not being subject to that is quite a freeing concept. I'm still getting used to that feeling of freedom. I just hope the other wounds that we have will not be so sensitive in the near future. Hugs to you too. Thanks for caring words.

 

[Overcomer]

I've read so many times about how our mothers have sent them a check or a card in the mail and it reminds me of how my mom does the same thing. My mom does this to other people too. One day, many years ago, when she was pulling this stunt with my brother, she told me her reasons for doing it. First she selects a card that can be read with a double meaning. Ex: Because you're such a great father you will be selected for the position again this year. She explained that it tells the recipient that there is a chance they wont be allowed to be in her family if they mess up and no one can understand this but the person she is sending it too. Second she puts a check in it. This she does to make sure the person she sent the card to, got her mail. Its a confirmation that she knows their correct address and they are still opening her mail and she is able to keep tabs on them. If it comes back it is the same thing. She knows she has the correct info and she knows they are opening what she sends. If it is cut up she knows she can still get to them. It's twisted, I know, but for all of you still getting mail from their moms, I thought you should know that they are not reaching out and you responding in pain, she is still trying to get to you. Its a twist of the knife she has in your back every time she does it. I want all y'all to be free.

Mothers with NPD are deceitful and will go to great lengths to get their pleasure. It seems the more deceptive and the more pain they cause the more pleasure they get. I didnt wait for my mom to block me of Facebook, I took the initiative. I blocked her. I end relationships with people if I find out they are connected to my mom. I dont wait for them to do it. If it means I have no contact with anyone in my family; nieces, nephews, aunts, uncles, cousins, siblings, brothers, sisters, or dad. I will walk away from them all. I did walk away from them all. I also learned that once I had the guts to do it, others followed. I now have a growing family. Aunts, uncles, cousins, nephews, and my dad have all sought me out and GET THIS they saw what I did and decided they werent alone and left too.

The relationships I am developing with these people is completely different than before. Its much better, we are closer, we have a trust, a bond, a connection and the truth is coming out. My aunt was not a drug addict, my uncle did not father several children from affairs, my dad was not imprisoned for child molestation. I learned her history with her parents and how she was mean even as a child herself. I learned about my ancestors and my heritage. Then I started to learn so much about me. My mom mistreated me from birth. Thus proving I had nothing to do with causing my abuse. The sad part is learning what she told my family about me when I was growing up. I was not the person she said I was. She told them I dropped out of high school and got my GED so no one came to my graduation. Truth is I did all 4 years of high school in 2 and was being honored, but all my family said they had better things to do then come to my graduation all because she lied. She stole that from me just because she could get away with it.

I still have painful memories but I would not be healing if it were not for the no contact. Her letters go into the trash, unopened, my voicemail message does not have my name and I dont acknowledge or listen to her messages, I blocked her on Facebook and set my hometown to another city and my privacy settings to the highest (she cant see me at all-not even as a friend of a friend), I dont talk to people about her (if they ask I am honest-I havnt heard from her and I have no idea how she is, its ok I like it like this), I check my public information often and even use a post office box instead of my street address. It's been over 8 years and Im still looking over my shoulder. Most of the healing I am going through is from pain caused not by her but by things she has done to set me up to be hurt: she has been pregnant 6 times by various boyfriends OF MINE (the first one was he was 14 and she was 32), she destroyed my reputation, she tried to kidnap my daughter, she beat my 2 year old daughter leaving black marks and tried to say I did it, and she gave me to a pedophile when I was 11 and I was violently raped by him (yes she knew BEFORE and after) she said it was my fault.

How stupid was I? All of that AND MORE and I was still trying to win her love. I was hurting so bad that I couldnt see straight. I was stuck and screaming and no one could hear me. I had nightmares several times a week and couldnt function. Now I am able to breath and work on my past. I walked away and it was the best decision of my life. No telling what would have happened if I had stayed any longer. I also questioned everything. It was hard to recreate myself. I had no idea who I was. I felt lost and even crazy. It was worth it. I would do it again a thousand times over. I will never go back!!!! I will never allow her in my life again. I dont know what I will do if I ever run into her again but I hope I dont acknowledge I recognize her. I dont want to even know when she dies. I no longer hate her. I just protect myself and mine from her.

 

[Frazzled]

I am so sorry these things have happened to you. My mother has set me up for hurt and failure but she hasn't reach these extreme's yet. I don't blame you one bit for wanting to run away from her as fast as you can. She obviously is determined to be destructive to everyone around her. God help anyone that is around her! I don't fully understand how it is that people that are like this seem to have few consequences in life and people believe what they say.

I don't want to walk away from my father but in order to get her to stop manipulating him to his detriment, I don't have a choice but to leave him behind. His health is bad, he has relinquished his patriarch role to my brother in law, who might I add seems to have similiar traits that my mother has. His father and himself have horrible relationships with everyone in their own family. They have little to no contact with their extended families. His father has been married multiple times and each one was a horrible experience for each wife and their children. They don't speak to this day. Why would you take relationship advice, which my mother does, from people who can't have healthy relationships on their own.

I struggle with the urge to go to each one of the members of the family and defend myself against the lies she has told. I don't feel like I have the strength to do it. I am emotionally and physically exhausted each time I have to plead my case with anyone. I also feel terrible that my husband and son have had their characters and credibility drug through the proverbial mud just as much as I have. She is my mother and I feel the need to block her ability to do hateful things to them but I can't possibly fathom the depths she will sink. Everytime you think she has hit the bottom and she can't possibly get worse she shocks me with what else she will come up with. I have no defense other than distance. Even if I say something completely benign she can spin it into something so outer limits and gets my dad riled up and he starts calling and yelling. This is not good for him at all and she doesn't seem to care but she puts up the veneer of caring and pokes her lip out. I have a need to tell him this is what I need to do to help him too. I can't bare leaving him without telling him that I don't see any other way. Even with all his faults throughout this whole thing I know we could have a relationship if he would not allow her to block it. She will. I am very certain of that. She divides and conquers. I struggle with the anger and resentment and have fantasies of punching her in the face. Of course I would never do that but I have thoughts of it. Physical pain would pale in comparison to the emotional scars she has left on the three of us. We are walking wounded and people can see it on my face, my husband's face and my son.

I had a hard time making the move to cut her out of our lives. It seemed so final and I couldn't say the words, they just wouldn't come out. It wasn't what I thought I wanted but I know in the back of my mind that I have no choice. She has pushed and pushed to this ending. I feel this is what she wanted because I wouldn't allow her to bully me anymore and that is her deal breaker.

Writing this out does help me and I hope you can get to a day where you don't have to look over your shoulder. That is a form of control that you are under too. I don't think you were stupid. We just don't want to believe that the person we thought they were wouldn't possibly be capable of making us feel this bad and they do it on purpose. I understand completely because I have a sense of panic when I see her or even if she drives by me. Complete unreasonable panic. I can't explain it but I know before she gets home, if she sees me, she will cook up some far-fetched tale of some horrible thing I have done to her. It's an everyday inner struggle because it is so fresh. It has really come to a head in the last couple of weeks and it is really ouchy! Thanks

 

[H011yHawkJ311yBean]

I struggle with the urge to go to each one of the members of the family and defend myself against the lies she has told. I don't feel like I have the strength to do it. I am emotionally and physically exhausted each time I have to plead my case with anyone.

In my case it's mostly my mom's side of the family that is just like her, so I don't bother with them. Only person on that side of the family that I barely communicate with is my mom's sister/my aunt. Occasionally, my aunt travels and was coming through our town and she was selling her wares at our local trade show. Suddenly out of the blue she asked me if she could stay at our house, and she never has before. I told her it was too short of notice, and she seemed fine with it, but then she asked me if I wanted to see her and have lunch somewhere. I was so paranoid that she wanted to talk about something related to my mom, that I didn't reply... I also haven't talked to her side of the family since my mom's mother's funeral. That's when the whole family started acting really odd, like throwing out our photos so they could use the frames and that sort of thing. lol How low can you go??!!

Luckily, on my dad's side of the family, everyone knows exactly what my mother is like. I asked and I've been told they know I am nothing like her, which is a huge relief. They know my mom likes to stir up trouble!!! It's so awesome that they love me and accept me. I have two brothers and one I talk to lives closer to this group of people. So it's really nice when we have vacation to go visit all the "normal" relatives! lol

I should also mention that I cleaned out my friends and I am just starting up again. I had to protect myself from having any relationship that bore resemblance to the one with my mother. I had a friend, for example, who would always try to manipulate me into doing things for her, even if I politely said no several times, she wouldn't leave it be. So I would end up doing things I didn't want to do. No more! I am starting to build friendships that are, I hope, a lot more stable and closer to what an actual normal relationship would be! lol It's tough going sometimes, but things are starting to look better.

I hope the same for you and everyone in the forum who has issues like we do (and other unrelated issues, but you know what I mean!!)...

 

[Overcomer]

Ive reread several of our posts on here and am beginning to see a common pattern. We all want to leave and even try to cut off communication with our mothers, some have had more success than others, but we dont want to leave alone. We all feel the need to wait until we can "save" someone else that is being hurt by our moms also. Whether its our dad, or our sister, or aunt,or brother, we all seem to look back and say "OK, I'm almost gone but I wont go without them". I also see that those people wont go. The people we all choose to "save" want to stay in the mess. For one reason or another they all choose to stay and us staying and waiting on them is hurting us. Why are we doing this to ourselves? It doesnt benefit us at all. No one recognizes the sacrifice we made. Are we staying so we can have a family member that will validate us? Are we really staying to save them? Is this part of the brainwashing we were given? That we cant make any choice on our own or follow through with what we want unless we are validated by someone else doing it too? Why are we so self sacrificing that we choose to walk through the pain again and again just so we can convince someone else to do things our way? Are we trying to manipulate others into doing something they dont want to do just because we are unhappy with the situation they are happy in?
For years, I wouldnt leave because I thought I was staying to save someone else. I thought my position in life was to protect others from my mom. The whole time I was miserable. When I went no contact I learned that those people I were trying to protect was actually happy in their situation. I had a real eye opener that I couldnt make other peoples choices for them. Some people are happy being treated that way. I dont pretend to understand why but I dont really care any more either. Let them be happy but let me be happy too. My trying to "open their eyes" or hurt for them or worry for them or convince them to do things my way was no different than me being forced to stay when I didnt want to. It was the same thing that I complained about being manipulated by my moms enablers. While I tried to convince my step-dad to leave because I loved him my step-dad tried to convince me to stay because he loved me. How are we any different. He was happy enabling her and I wasnt. I wanted to be happy away from her and take him with me but he wouldnt have been happy. How is one any different than the other?

 

[Frazzled]

I suppose you are right. I guess the viewpoint I was looking at it is I cared about what my dad thought of me and I didn't want him to believe that I was capable of doing the things my mother was accusing me of. I had already gotten to the point where I could've cared less what my sisters and the majority of my family thought but my dad was different. He would say that I was the only one he could just sit and talk to and I understood him. I felt a closer connection to him. I thought he was super-man when I was younger and now when I look at him and realize how weak he is, I have a hard time with it. My mother rules with fear and an iron fist. She doesn't discourage the feeling that she would dump him flat on his rear if he doesn't do her bidding. I guess I overestimated his attachment to his daughter and his ability to see through all the crap that she spins. Everytime I talk to him, I hear the pain but I can't believe that anyone that knows what's going on can stand for it and not intervene. This is what I have had to come to terms with in the past couple of weeks. It's a roller coaster of fear, pain, am I making the right choice, am I ready to cut the rope of attachment - types of feelings. It's really difficult to see what is the best when you are still in the middle of it I guess. I appreciate your candidness. I needed it said to me that way and I didn't think about it in that manner. Thanks

 

[Overcomer]

Frazzled-you're not the only one. We all do it and we all did it. I'm not sure why but its a common denominator among us all. I'm glad you were able to see things from another perspective. I know its hard. Probably the hardest thing you will ever do. You cant force someone to do what you want them to do just because you think its best for them. I'm sure your dad will see your strength in choosing to leave. It may just be the very thing that opens his eyes. If and when he ever leaves, you will be one of the first people he reaches out to, I am sure of that. He may not even realize how hard it is on you being there and think you can stand some more because you haven't left yet. He knows the connection y'all had and will miss you when you're no longer available and may even get mad at you for awhile but he will eventually know. Just remember that you can't fight this battle. The more you stay around to try to save your reputation the more you lose it. Those people that understand you you will never have to explain yourself to. The loudest thing we can ever say is to silently walk away. Your words will never impact him as long as your mothers voice is in his head. But its his choice to when he stops listening to her. I feel for you but know you can do this. Freedom is just around the corner. Its like living in a prison cell with the door standing wide open. Walk through the door. The world is waiting for you and its wonderful.

 

[H011yHawkJ311yBean]

In my link http://forum.psychlinks.ca/narcissi...der/26374-happy-narcissistic-mothers-day.html on this forum, I pasted an email that I sent to my mom and dad... And I got a reply from both...

It was my dad's reply that I was a bit stunned about. It felt like a slap in the face. I used to think he was nearly a saint, putting up with mom all those years. And being so super-nice and loving. Well, the only problem is that he enables and enforces everything my mom does. He might be the total opposite of her (or used to be, he is more like her now), but it eventually dawned on me that he had a part to play in all of this. And he played it by hiding, not being emotionally present, taking her crap, running away a couple of times, allowing things she did to slide, never standing up for his children or family, and basically letting her run things. She would complain that he never lifted a finger to help her discipline the kids, but what he did was worse: stand by and let her do what she wanted. He let her do everything. At first, you would think this would leave him blameless, if he didn't do a thing. But really he didn't do anything to stop it. So he was every bit as guilty as she was. If your dad lets your mom belittle you, beat you, or smack you, how does that make him blameless? Took me a while to figure that out.

This may also shed some light (also in the Forum): http://forum.psychlinks.ca/narcissi...fathers-role-when-mother-is-a-narcissist.html

If someone wants to stay with the Narcissistic spouse, then they either aren't ready to leave, or they aren't ever going to leave. My dad isn't leaving.

PS: My dad taught me that love was putting up with people no matter how badly they abuse you. Him staying with my mom showed me that it was okay to tolerate someone making you feel like a loser, and not caring about you, and using you, and so on. What it taught me was that pity was love. What it taught me was that I should stay in a relationship with someone who self-medicates (that was my mom), and that if I left them it would show them I didn't love them, so I had to stay. I almost ended up in a very abusive relationship. The man drank and did drugs, and controlled me (which is what I was used to) to the point where I lost 15 lbs and wasn't allowed to eat very much, wasn't allowed to visit my own family and friends, and wasn't allowed to talk on the phone, etc... So that's what I got from my dad.

 

[Frazzled]

I know that my dad does enable her a great deal, I've seen it in action. She sat and lied right in front of him and instead of him going whoa hold on, he just let her keep running her mouth. I practically told him what she was going to do next, of which she did do and he still can't take a lead role. I felt swept away by this whole thing, that has a mind of it's own now. It is extremely difficult thinking that if something happens to my dad that she is going to keep me from being with him or being at his funeral. She has expressed these things to me. I called her cruel and mean, that was all I could say to her. I wanted to blast her but I just couldn't get my mouth to say the words. My father is 77 years old. He has had a really bad year for his health and the clock is ticking. I don't know if I can bear it if I can't fix something with him before he dies. I really know that handling that will be so intensely painful for me and my son if we can't come to terms with this. I don't know what to say to my son and I don't know what's going to happen. There are so many facets to this that your brain is overloading with the roller coaster of anger, fear, sadness and pain. I am very overwhelmed with what will happen if he dies. Do you go to the funeral? Do you stay away and go to the grave after? So many doubts..............

 

[Overcomer]

Stop fighting Frazzled. It's hard because you want so much to set things right but you can't. You cant win this fight. You cant get what you want. I feel so bad for you but you have to understand that the cost of your fight is greater than you know. If your dad wanted to hear you, he would. If he wanted to know what you have to say, he would make a way to find out. You are fighting both your mother and your father to have this moment with your father and he doesnt want it. He has chosen sides. Im sorry but you cant keep going on like this. It is taking its toll on you and your relationships with the ones that love you and want to be with you and are seeing you hurt and confused and overwhelmed. It hurts them that they cant help you. Would it help to hear your dad tell you the words "I dont want to hear what you have to say"? You have the power to save yourself and that is all.
Your dad is not innocent in all of this. If it werent for him, your mom would never have been able to do the things she did to you. Thats what an enabler is. Your dad gave your mom the ability to abuse you. He knew and he doesnt want to be saved from it. He likes his position and doesnt want to leave.
I can plainly see that your head is spinning and you are so confused. Stop taking on problems that are not yours. Stop trying to rescue someone that doesnt want to be rescued. Dont look at his health, or his age, or his position, or what you used to think he was. You are choosing to be in pain by choosing to stay in that fight. When you go no contact your son will see and respect that. My daughter was 14 when I went no contact. She later told me she was so relieved when I did. She said she had gotten to the point of hating my mom for what she was doing to me and felt so guilty for hating her that she had started cutting herself. I caused that, I caused her to be hurt, because I tried to stay in and fix just one more thing.
Have you ever seen the movie Indiana Jones with his father? There is a scene at the end where they are trying to reach for the Cup of Jesus and it has fallen into a crack in the floor. The girl is barely hanging on and Indiana is trying to get her attention so he can pull her up and she is so desperate to reach it she falls to her death. Then its Indiana's turn. Luckily his dad does get his attention and Indiana turns away from the cup and gets pulled to safety. You are so focused on your dad that you dont realize the danger you are in. Look at your husband and your son. Let them pull you away from the mess. Let go of all of it. It is causing pain and hate and confusion and fear and worry. All of which is for you from those who love you, not you for your dad.
Your prison door is open. Just step through it. Let the healing begin. Not just for you but your husband and son need healing too. I know you can do this. I know you want to. If you need help get someone, a professional. They will give a face to face support that is more than you can get here. It will be worth it. Being able to breath again is amazing. There are times I feel so free I feel like I could fly. I had put on 150lbs trying to use food to force down the feelings I was having wanted to be the good daughter. It is coming off. On its own. I used to be thin. Im 5'10" and was a size 8 after I had my daughter. When I went no contact I was a size 26. The weight is coming off. Pretty much on its own. I have learned that I have a voice, I have things I enjoy and its ok to enjoy them, I have learned that its ok to have emotions, and most of all I learned that I am lovable. I have people that love me. I want this for you. I want you to be happy and to be free. I dont want you to hurt anymore.

 

[H011yHawkJ311yBean]

I know how hard it is, too. The only reason for years that I stayed talking/contact with my parents was because of my dad.

I realize now that if he wanted to get away from her he would have long ago.

I now have to resort to blocking them both, because it's like he's tied to her at the hip. My parents have become one two-headed monster. I've decided if my dad or mom dies, I am not coming to the funeral. They are going to be buried on the West Coast where they live now, and I live way over more central in Canada. What I think of it is that they are both already dead. I've said my goodbyes. It's just like in real-life. You go through depression, bargaining, denial, anger, etc -- all the steps of grieving the death of a loved one. They aren't physically dead yet, but they are otherwise.

If someone wants to go down with the ship, you have to save yourself. You can't save someone who chained themselves to the mast. Your dad has tied himself to your mother and won't let go. He's welded himself to her.

I hope you find the strength one day to decide what you need to do, and my heart goes out to you.

 

[Thehurtstopshere]

Good morning Jolly, as usual I see something in your post that I really relate to and would love to mention..My DAD..my stepdad is the only dad I ever knew so I refer to him sometimes as just DAD and at times as stepdad..based on mood maybe? I always felt so horrible about the way my dad is treated by NM. For my whole life I kind of looked at it like we were in it together and he was just as abused as us but since i had to break ties, dad's loyalty is of course to HER. He hasnt gone behind her back to so much as call and check on my health- and I have had to accept that he was the OTHER adult-he saw what was going on and never did anything to help-and at times believe me- he should have! I no longer feel like "poor DAD"..I did my whole life and now i think he is just as bad as her. sadly, he has a sad and miserable life and is treated like crap but how sad that he knew my sisters and I rallied around him those years (and my other sisters still do) and he just reinforced that she was QUEEN! mg:

 

[Frazzled]

Yes, I know no contact is the best for me and my family. I am coming to terms with it. It sux, I really hate it, and I am dealing with the loss. It is like they died but I think I did a tremendous amount of grieving early in the game. I had a bat to the head about their not being the people I thought they were. I guess because of my role in the family of being the fixer, I had a difficult time thinking I couldn't fix this one. I do feel a lot better over the weekend and sometimes feel a punch to the stomach when the thoughts sneak in. I have been trying to distract myself and redirect my own thoughts away if they try to sneak in. My son is feeling some relief by they way he is relating. He has expressed a need to get a few things off of his chest and I have really discouraged it so he isn't hurt more. I'm not sure it's wise to not let him do that but I want to follow through with the no contact. I have blocked all of her abilities to contact us except our phone number which we use for our business. That won't stop me from screening, thank God for caller id. I am trying to be pro-active and take my life back. I do want that, more than anything. I hope that dealing with death is a long way off. I still don't know how that is going to go. I guess I'll have to cross that bridge when I get to it. It's a daily choice and I am trying to make the right one and lead it in that direction to get us out of this rut. I'm trying hard. Thanks Overcomer for smacking me in line. I did need that.

 

[H011yHawkJ311yBean]

Hey Frazzled,

You could tell your son to write all that he wants to get off his chest in a letter, stick it in an envelope, and you could do the same... But instead of mailing it, because even if your mom got the letters, it would come to no good (probably make things worse)... So I would recommend burning them in some sort of little ceremony (a big bonfire would be cool, but improvised in a safe place in a metal garbage can in the backyard could work, too)... Heck you could do it weekly or once a month. Just imagine those thoughts and bad feelings burning up and going away with the smoke billowing up and away from yourselves... Talk about it. Get it out into the open.

That way no one is holding their feelings inside. You can also talk to a therapist about it together (or separately). People grieve in different ways and at different rates.

Don't rush yourself into it, if you want. It sort of happened "naturally" with me. I didn't listen to what everyone else said, I just went with when it felt right for me. If you do it when it feels right, you're more likely to stay that way (no communication) instead of feeling rushed and like you missed out on something or didn't try something. On the other hand, of course, there's not much you can do, and that's the hard part.

I was the fixer, too...

 

[wanda20]

I know that my dad does enable her a great deal, I've seen it in action. She sat and lied right in front of him and instead of him going whoa hold on, he just let her keep running her mouth. I practically told him what she was going to do next, of which she did do and he still can't take a lead role. I felt swept away by this whole thing, that has a mind of it's own now. It is extremely difficult thinking that if something happens to my dad that she is going to keep me from being with him or being at his funeral. She has expressed these things to me. I called her cruel and mean, that was all I could say to her. I wanted to blast her but I just couldn't get my mouth to say the words. My father is 77 years old. He has had a really bad year for his health and the clock is ticking. I don't know if I can bear it if I can't fix something with him before he dies. I really know that handling that will be so intensely painful for me and my son if we can't come to terms with this. I don't know what to say to my son and I don't know what's going to happen. There are so many facets to this that your brain is overloading with the roller coaster of anger, fear, sadness and pain. I am very overwhelmed with what will happen if he dies. Do you go to the funeral? Do you stay away and go to the grave after? So many doubts..............

I read your post today Frazzled and related to it immensely. I haven't talked to my narcissistic mum since Xmas 2011 when she called to say she hate me on Christmas day and hung up on me. We hadn't talk for a year previous to that call. I never get to speak to my dad - and haven't for a least a couple of years. The "rule" is, if I don't get along with mum, I can't talk to my Dad. My Dad and I were close when I was in my teens and early twenties. Anyway, I digress.

My sister interstate still keeps in phone contact. When I talked to her over the phone last night she mentioned that Dad had told her he has prostate cancer. My heart dropped! He didn't say whether it was in the early stages, but said it was picked up through x-rays and blood tests. So maybe it is still in the early stages and managable with the doctor's help.

My sister asked me not to rush off and try to call him. That's because last time when I went to their front door to ask if all was okay with another situation, I was not allowed in the home and then proceeded to tell off my cousin for over an hour and a half for asking me to check if they were okay. My sister learned from that and didn't want me contacting them.

One of my great fears too frazzled is that he will die and I won't be able to say goodbye or that I love him. So last night raised that all to the surface again. My mum has made it very clear to my other sister (who has no contact with my mum for the last 8 years) that if something happens to mum or dad we are not to go to see them in the hospital and we are not allowed at their funeral. Only one sibling is still in contact with them (interstate), and that is because since she divorced her husband of 23 years recently and my parents think she is "out of the sphere of evil influence" of my ex-brother in law.

So I will be very angry and upset if my father takes a serious turn and I cannot be there. I have even started thinking of sending cards again on Easter, Mothers Day, Fathers Day, Christmas so I can get "back in the good books" so I can see my father in case anything happens. My sister interstate says I can do that if it will help me, but I don't what to do. Any suggestions? Anyone been in a situation where you cannot see your parents because they don't want to see you in serious illness?

 

[Frazzled]

Hi Wanda20, I'm not sure what to do either. I struggle with that daily when I see a commercial about cards or close relationships on tv shows between family members. It is almost like an electric shock. I know that it is going to be bad when my dad passes and I am fighting with intense anger towards my mother because of it. I have a difficult time sharing this with the one remaining family member that I have, my aunt, because she just feels that I am being selfish and not thinking of my dad. She is also about 4 years behind on this fight and has no idea how much I have tried and fought to save a relationship that I know my mother wanted to destroy. If she found out that something bothered me she would make sure she did that same thing even more. I feel now she is still hell-bent on making me suffer by taking everything away from me that she can and that was being there for my family, it was a very high priority. She has been able to take away the ability for me to do that by destroying my credibility and my character with the family by isolating me from them. You have to go through her to have a relationship with them and I know they don't believe anything I tell them because of what she has said. If you open that door again, and I'm speaking from where I am at right now, you will probably get her cranked up again and she is ready to start swinging at you, figuratively speaking. I read repeatedly that this is narcissistic supply. I want to take that supply away from my mother, I really don't even like calling her that anymore, I might switch to nm. If she wants that supply she will have to go somewhere else and I think my nm will start in on my older sister. She is a nm clone and probably would get her own supply out of it. It is a tangled web of disfunction and I was too close to it for years to see it. I had people to tell me that they couldn't understands how I stood up under the pressure that she put on me and I was stunned that anyone could see it. I thought it was just me. I guess it was conditioning that occurred over many years that it didn't take much towards the end to knock me back in line until the light of day was shown on it. Once that happens you can't go back. It's impossible because your emotional skin is burned and every touch is intensely painful. Sorry I'm rambling but I have so many thoughts today.

I would really think about what you are expecting from your communication. I am doing this myself. Is it for him or for you? Do you think her attitude will have warmed over time? Will it cause more conflict for your nm to use and make him miserable? I have to keep reminding myself too that our fathers may be enabling them as well so there is responsibility across the board. This is a tough one to come to terms with. It is painful that your father wouldn't protect you from pain and it sux! Can you go back there? I'm not so sure that I can. I hope this helps a little. It helps me everytime I write something out. God bless and I hope we both can find peace with what we are dealing with.

 

[wanda20]

Thanks for your advice Frazzled.

I decided to call my sister interstate (the one who still talks to mum and dad) to say hello. She mentioned to me at the end of the call that Dad had called her because he hadn't heard from her in over two weeks. When he called her, he said he was deeply depressed and didn't want to live anymore. She spent an hour talking to him. He asked how me and my other sister were going (we don't talk to them both). He obviously still cares about us. My narcissistic mum never asks how I am when I have called her in the past because its all about her. At the end, my sister said, I shouldn't have told you because now you are upset. I said I am not upset just concerned. I felt like I should make the effort to get along with mum so I can talk to dad (who is 85 and has prostate cancer). I am so angry that I can't and unsure what I should do now. I guess if Dad wants to talk to me, it has to be his choice. Geez, I just wish I could sort this out somehow. Thanks for letting me vent here. I really appreciate it.

Take care all,
Wanda

 

[Frazzled]

I keep hearing people around me say you can only be controlled by someone if you let it but there are some people that control you and push to control with any benign contact with them. My nm is this way, she will puppetize you the entire time she's with you. That is why I have a hard time being around her even to be there for my father. She will constantly dog, pick, gode, and guilt me with every word she says. I have a hard time letting these things roll off of my back because the pressure was so constant and part of the reason why I had such a huge amount of resentment was because I let it "roll" for so long, years.

Perhaps your dad should contact you. I don't know how to handle that either because my father could contact me, he just chooses not to. I have tried with him and he is so snowed and cow-tows to my nm so badly that it is sickening. But, I also want to prevent him from dealing with it so I keep my distance from him to keep him out of the middle of all this mess. That's why is upsets me when my aunt says I am being selfish. If I was being selfish I would keep putting him in the middle of the fray. Maybe my rationale is off center but I feel that is for the best for both of us. I have analyzed and over-analyzed that to make sure that I am making a good decision with this area of the fight. Who knows......

We just have to do what we can live with for today. Vent away. I do it too.

 

[wanda20]

Thanks for your reply Frazzled. Sounds like we have a very similar situation with our parents. I have decided at this point, not to contact them for the same reasons you mentioned. I cannot go through the emotional trauma of having to deal with my nm just to get to my dad. He is supporting my nm. If he wants to talk to me, he has my number. But he won't call until mum has me at her beck and call again. Thanks again.

Wanda