Questions Regarding Cognitive Behavioral Therapy

[Into The Light]

how would you describe the difference between emotions and feelings? i always used those words interchangably but it sounds like there is a distinction.

 

[stargazer]

I don't know the distinction in psychology or even in common parlance, but in Buddhism (at least what I was taught by Tulku) emotions are things that are generally to be acknowledged without being either indulged or suppressed, whereas feelings are things to be expanded, enhanced, and increased. I am unconvinced that this is a useful distinction when it comes to CBT, as it only comes from my Buddhist practice, and from that of a particular school of Buddhist thought.

For me, I think of feelings as things like "love," "joy," "bliss," etc. and emotions as things like "anger," "hurt," "fear," etc. -- but I'm sure that's only my own personal distinction. I think that it's more likely that they're used almost interchangeably in modern psychology and in common language, so I guess what I'm saying is, I don't know.

 

[David Baxter PhD]

On a side note, a lawyer friend of mine starts every morning by reading portions of Joyce's Ulysses on the toilet seat, because he claims it gets his brain going.

I'm not sure it's his brain that Ulysses is getting going - I couldn't finish that novel or Finnegan's Wake.

Portrait of the Artist was before he went into his full blown stream of consciousness phase... mg:

 

[stargazer]

Not only could I not finish Finnegan's Wake, but I once had a hard time sitting through a production of Finian's Rainbow. I'm telling you, man, I'm nothing but bad.

 

[stargazer]

A couple of things that might help, stargazer:
The second thing that strikes me is the phrase "made to feel depressed". Another person cannot "make" us do anything. What we feel is our responsibilty alone.

ThatLady, now that we've communicated a little bit off the group, I think you may have misinterpreted a turn of phrase of mine. I'm a person who takes pains to be aware that other people do not "make" me feel one way or another, or in any way "cause" my negative thoughts and feelings. I had been hoping this would be evident in my posts. So not only was I somewhat put off at first, but I had to search through my posts to find out where I could possibly have made such a statement as you describe.

I think you are referring to where I wrote "I get angry at the fact that I was somehow made to feel depressed." In that statement, I was by no means suggesting that it was John or any other human being who "made" me feel depressed. That was the very reason why I phrased it: "I get angry at the fact that I was somehow made to feel depressed." "Somehow made," being made by...by what? A thought in my mind.

What I meant to express was that I was angered at being somehow jarred out of an excellent mood. This is something that happens to me frequently. I was not suggesting that John did this to me, either intentionally or unintentionally.

Your first point is well-taken, as in the realm of mental health I think a lot of us are confused about our identities, which is part of why we are seeking help. But I just want you to know that, artistically, I know who I am. I'm just waiting for the world to find out.

They're just people and they make mistakes, or have difficulties of their own that manifest in "preachiness" or intrusiveness. They don't mean harm. They're trying to help, but their way of doing so doesn't work well for us. These are the people we can value as friends, but take their "advice" with a grain of salt. It doesn't need to make us angry unless WE allow it to do so.

That's a very helpful insight. What's probably happening with me is the attempt to undo a lifetime of *allowing* these sorts of preachy people to make me angry. I think I do know what you mean. I've met people who come across in ways that are somehow self-aggrandazing, as though going overboard in trying to prove to others that they are of value. It probably comes from some kind of inferiority complex. Perhaps my friend John is in that vein, I don't know.

Anyway, thanks for your comments. I'll try not to speak so hastily in the future.

 

[stargazer]

Hi everybody. I'm just posting here because I figure it's the place you can find me these days if you want to. Today we're having the six-hour recording session in Berkeley, and I've been preparing for it (with quite a bit of anxiety) throughout the week. Yesterday a lot of last-minute stuff came up, and once I got everything done, I headed straight for bed, and amazed myself by sleeping unusually well for two consecutive nights. I think the meds are helping with that, actually, although the fact that I was exhausted might have had something to do with it as well. This morning I went running for the first time in near-on two months. My "excuse" for not running is that my shoes have been totally worn-out, and I wear them 24/7 in the absence of another pair. But once I was able to negotiate my paycheck (it took 3 days due to a bank hold) I finally lowered my standard enough to go down to Ross Dress-4-Less and nab a $20 pair of marked-down, off-brand running shoes. I ran in them this morning, and they felt just as good as any $140 pair of Asics or Nikes I'd have bought in the past. I bet they'll last just as long, too.

So I'm feelin' pretty good. My best friend Rob e-mailed me that he's happening to be in town this morning, so we're going to do breakfast. Then me & the boys are hitting the road at high noon. The girls couldn't make it, so we'll have to over-dub their parts later, but my female soloist is driving up to Berkeley from San Jose.

Wish us luck.

 

[David Baxter PhD]

Good luck.

 

[stargazer]

Thanks, David. I'll keep you posted.

 

[Cat Dancer]

I hope it all goes well.

 

[sister-ray]

good luck Stargazer

 

[stargazer]

David, I'm still not receiving notifications of replies--not consistently anyway. There were no notifications for Janet's or through-these-eyes's. Not sure what's up with that.

Yeah, thanks guys--it went pretty well! I was on "Plan C" by the time we got there--two singers had very bad colds, one was too sick to show, and one showed but we couldn't use anything she did, and I excused her after an hour. Then the engineer and I sat down & did the Final Mix of three of the songs.

My web site is down for lack of payment of fees, but I posted all three of them on a Music MySpace at http://myspace.com/theburdenofeden -- the sweet voice singing the middle of the 3 songs is my 15-year old voice student, Tessa.

This morning was a big deal in church, it was the 100th Anniversary of the Episcopal Church in America...(I *think* they meant America...never quite got it) and the Bishop Emeritus was preaching. It was also the first time in my life I'd ever sung in a church choir.

I was *extremely* anxious beforehand. Almost panic-attack level. I didn't know the music very well, and I was having transportation issues--for some reason the Dial-a-Ride wouldn't get me there this time...he just refused, on some grounds I didn't quite grasp, something about my not having made a reservation, or whatever. Before he always just would say "okay I'll be right over!"

Anyway, I got there, and once it started, I was able pretty much to focus on the liturgy and the singing. Then, when it was over, I was immensely relieved, and became somewhat talkative and smiley.

Have been through some anger issues over an ISP unilaterally taking $180 out of my account yesterday, just as I was about to pay the studio the full fees. The card was declined, and I called and found out. It was a cancellation fee I'd tried to dispute, and a long story. (I'd moved out of the service area, which ought to have exempted me from the fee. But I couldn't prove it.)

Tomorrow I get another paycheck, which is about $380, but I promised the people at the studio I'd send them the remaining $190 I owe them. I have been angry repeatedly in my head but have stopped short of calling the ISP, because I think it would lead to a lengthy dispute that would probably not do any good. I was really counting on having the full $380.

But I'll manage. Oh, and by the way, in case people don't know, none of these studio fees come from me. They all come from a backer-type person who lives in this area, but he prefers to write a cashier's cheque to me and then have me pay the studio. I didn't want to carry $390 in cash around, so I loaded it onto my debit card. That was my mistake--I had no idea the ISP was laying in wait for my cancellation fee!! So now I have to pay some money to the studio anyway, even though it's way out of my financial ballpark right now.

Anyway, just want to clarify that I'm certainly in no financial position to be doing studio recordings, but I have been thankful for the support of the backer. Let me know if you like the tunes. Thanks!

 

[stargazer]

I don't think there's been a reply to my previous post yet, but that's okay, since I was veering off the subject. I'm back to CBT now.

Something just happened, and I wrote down ten negative thoughts that seemed to race immediately through my head:

(1) She's not recognizing the value of my offer.
(2) She's blowing me off.
(3) She's been blowing me off ever since I came back into town.
(4) She's lying to me.
(5) She's hiding something from me.
(6) I'm not important to her anymore.
(7) She thinks I'm too interested in her kids.
(8) She thinks I'm too interested in her entire family.
(9) She thinks I'm interfering eith their personal family business.
(10) She's trying to squeeze me out.

It could go on from there, but then I had to identify the feelings:

(1) I feel rejected.
(2) I feel misunderstood.
(3) I feel insignificant.
(4) I feel threatened.
(5) I feel angry.
(6) I feel indignant.
(7) I feel invalidated.
(8) I feel hurt.
(9) I feel shaken.
(10) I feel incapable of getting over it.

Now my question is this: the way I worded those, beginning with "I feel" -- are all those "feelings?" Last time, I just wrote down: depression, frustration, anger, futility, disappointment....

See what I'm getting at?

Anyway, I'm not sure what to do from here. My first instinct was to post on PsychLinks about it, but maybe taking a walk would be a good idea. It's starting to cool down, and the sun will be setting soon.

(Interesting how it won't let me make the number "8" enclosed in parantheses without making it look like an emoticon...)

 

[Into The Light]

yes those are all feelings as well but you can go more basic. for example when i feel misunderstood i am actually feeling lonely, sad, angry, or a combination. your number 10 makes me think of hopelessness. so you need to translate those things.

the feelings i put down usually can be categorized in some basic feelings, which are: angry, anxious, embarrassed, guilty, hopeless, lonely, sad and stressed (page 43, ten days to self-esteem by david d. burns)

angry includes: mad, resentful, upset, p.o.'d, irritated, furious, ticked off, incensed, enraged
anxious includes: worried, panicky, nervous, afraid, fearful, concerned, scared, frightened, uneasy
embarrassed includes: foolish, self-conscious, flustered
guilty includes: ashamed, at fault, bad
hopeless includes: discouraged, pessimistic, desperate
lonely includes: abandoned, alone, rejected
sad includes: bummed out, depressed, down, disappointed, unhappy, hurt
stressed includes: overwhelmed, pressured, burned out, overworked, tense, uptight

so i would say maybe try to put your feelings into those categories to get a better idea of what they are.

 

[stargazer]

angry includes: mad, resentful, upset, p.o.'d, irritated, furious, ticked off, incensed, enraged
anxious includes: worried, panicky, nervous, afraid, fearful, concerned, scared, frightened, uneasy
embarrassed includes: foolish, self-conscious, flustered
guilty includes: ashamed, at fault, bad
hopeless includes: discouraged, pessimistic, desperate
lonely includes: abandoned, alone, rejected
sad includes: bummed out, depressed, down, disappointed, unhappy, hurt
stressed includes: overwhelmed, pressured, burned out, overworked, tense, uptight

so i would say maybe try to put your feelings into those categories to get a better idea of what they are.

Yes, that helps a lot. For example, when I said "I feel angry," it could have been anywhere along a whole spectrum from "resentful" or "upset" to "incensed" or "enraged." I think in this case, it was most close to "p-o'd" or "ticked" or "miffed."

A lot of the times, I know I don't feel good, and I feel as though something that has happened has triggered a very sudden not-good feeling, but I can't quite identify what the feeling is. So yes, this should help quite a bit. Thanks.

 

[stargazer]

You know, I took a walk, and found a bench to sit down on, and as I reflected, I realized that what I actually felt was lonely. All I'd wanted to do was drop off the CD that their daughter is singing in, and they were having a family function when I called, and she (the Mom) seemed a little stressed perhaps, but all that was really going on inside me was that I wanted to be able to walk down to the house, and in addition to dropping off the CD, maybe have a conversation, chat, and so forth. I was lonely, that was all. And besides, when you're a teacher and you only have three students, you feel lonely on the teacher's level. I had all kinds of kids when I was working down in San Jose. Here I only have three kids, and maybe I've been glomming onto them too much. That's what the Mom might be picking up on, I don't know. But it comes down to loneliness. That I know.

It somehow got better after I got in touch with it.

 

[Into The Light]

i am glad it made you feel better stargazer. that is the whole purpose of the mood logs. this is your first evidence that these exercises help. as time goes by you won't even have to write these things down, you'll be able to recover from negative emotions fairly quickly by running the exercise through your mind. i'm not there yet but this is how it's meant to work.

 

[stargazer]

Thanks for your support, and for the information. I think I've always been the type of person who can be in a "perfectly good mood" and then suddenly be jarred out of it by a single relatively minor occurrence. It triggers a total mood shift, and I start to feel bewildered and frustrated, and eventually angry. This happens with me all the time, and I think it's a lot of why I lost that job I had in the South Bay. (There were of course other factors.)

So, it does help to write these things down, how I was disturbed after receiving an e-mail from my friend John, and disturbed after feeling blown off when I called my client. (I'm trying to word these carefully so no one thinks I am deluding myself into believe that John or my client "made" me feel this way. That, in itself, is hard to do, simply grammatically, if not psychologically.)

Anyway, yes, both exercises I did were helpful, and also the greater list you provided was also helpful. Thanks.