Tough Time

[healthbound]

I'm going through a tough time and I'm not sure how to best ride it out.

I feel unstable and unpredictable and that scares me. I feel angry and embarrassed that I keep returning to suicide as an option. I feel even more embarrassed to talk about it because my sister took her life and I know how upsetting the entire subject is. I also feel guilty that I would even have these thoughts/feelings/desires. I have a son who I love very much and I can't seem to make any sense about why I would even consider such a disturbing option knowing how important he and his development is to me.

I also feel very conflicted about posting this. I want to talk about it because I want to move through it, but I don't want to be a freak or have people stop being supportive of me. What I do want is to acknowledge how sad I feel and work through it without turning to such a destructive and permanent way of coping with it.

Sorry to be such a downer and thanks for reading.

 

[ThatLady]

Personally, I'm glad you have posted this. We're here to share the good times AND the bad times, healthbound. If this is a bad time for you, perhaps sharing it will make it less difficult in some ways. We often find that others have dealt with similar problems, and have very similar feelings. Sometimes, they may have found ways to cope that we haven't even thought about! We get to learn, and others get to share. It's a win-win situation.

 

[foghlaim]

Dear HB, TL is right and if i remember correctly you've said as much to other members here. It is okay to talk about this subject with us, if not us then with whom?? we're your friends here and we are here to support each other thru thick and thin.

I also feel guilty that I would even have these thoughts/feelings/desires.

I could have sworn that you are human HB, and being human, I for one know what it is like to have these thoughts\feelings ect.. It is not a nice space tobe in , and i'm sorry you are having such a tough time of it. You are NOT a freak! Can Isuggest you drop the guilty feeling for a start okay. you have nothing to feel guilty about. Unless of course you are guilty of being human and we are all in that boat with you ok.

Coping with these fellings \thoughts ect is very hard and i don't believe can be done on your own, I couldn't do it on my own. I too came here and received such wonderful support and advice and also spoke to my therapist ect, and i'm still here TG.
Can you ring your doc tomorow? or your therapist?? or even talk to Dr. B here thru pm or email? have you got some emergency numbers you can ring if all the above gets too overwhelming for you??
and Yes do think of your son, the thoughts of him being without his mother i'm sure will help keep you from doing anything destructive.

and HB.. you don't have to make any sense of why you are having suicidal thoughts, just accept that you are, (you have i think anyway) and acknowledge where your'e at. depression gives us no reason for thinking\feeling like we do, all we can do is recognise it (which u have done) and look for support and help as we go thru it.
I hope you can talk to your doc or therapist soon, and that you will keep talking to us here.
Thank you for posting the above, i realise it was a very hard decision to make but you made it and i hope it helped in some small way to post it.

feel better soon HB.
thinking of you

nsa

 

[foghlaim]

sorry that reply is so long. didn't realise it till ihad posted it..

feel free to edit it if necessary..

nsa

 

[Into The Light]

hi healthbound, i can totally relate to everything you have written. i was having thoughts of suicide too but was scared to talk about it, scared to push the people i love away if i talked about it. at first i could deal with it because i wasn't serious, it was just thoughts of what if, and how. i actually had a way of doing it too, and that was very upsetting to me, but for some reason i could not get rid of the item even when i thought things were going better.

things got worse and to a point where i just couldn't deal with my situation anymore. it got very scary. what made me feel the most hopeless of all was the thought that if i gave in to my thoughts that my children would grow up without me, and that they would end up going through all the pain i am going through. it would make me the worst mother in the world and ruin their lives. instead of my children giving me hope it just seemed to make me more frantic. i felt like i had no way out no matter how bad things got, because of my responsibility to care for them. i don't know if this is how you feel. it was big guilt for me and it did not help.

in the end i had a very good talk with people at the hospital and it really helped me a lot. i've gotten past my crisis and the guilt and shame of having the thoughts i was having. i also have some friends that stuck by me when i felt i was losing all control over my thoughts and actions. i did not think people would care enough to do that, i just felt like i was some kind of crazy person. to have people stick by me no matter what has helped enormously.

please don't feel guilty or embarrassed. this is all part of the disease. our brains are not working like they should be. when i couldn't deal with things anymore, they told me the brain is like a computer and that it just crashed. you're just dealing with a computer that has some kind of virus and is acting a little out of whack.

find people you can talk to that won't judge you. i know this can be very scary and you may run into people who can't support you. don't take that personally. some people do not know how to react, i probably wouldn't have either had i not gone through depression myself. not their fault, nor yours.

i guess the big thing is talk talk talk and tell people how frightening this is and how it makes you feel. get it out, it makes it less scary and it also lets people help you deal with it.

take care and keep posting here, we're here for you.

 

[Retired]

Healthbound,

The best thing you could have done was to share your feelings and reach out to your friends. Losing your sister to suicide must have been an unimaginable tragedy.

Your love for your son is your strongest reason for living, and would be the reason for contacting a local crisis line to be pointed to a resource where you can get some support and counselling to get you through this difficult time.

Do you have a local resource you can contact?

 

[^^Phoenix^^]

I feel even more embarrassed to talk about it because my sister took her life and I know how upsetting the entire subject is. I also feel guilty that I would even have these thoughts/feelings/desires. I have a son who I love very much and I can't seem to make any sense about why I would even consider such a disturbing option knowing how important he and his development is to me.

I also feel very conflicted about posting this. I want to talk about it because I want to move through it, but I don't want to be a freak or have people stop being supportive of me.

Hi HB
Talking about this must be hard for the people around you, having lost you sister. However, do you feel that there is no-one that would want to hear from you feeling like this? Perhaps if people in your family knew how you were feeling, your sisters memory would shock them into helping you as much as they could? I am glad that your son is a reminder of the people that need you here. When I have suicidal thoughts, guilt is often the reason that I don't go through with it. And while, at the time it makes me feel worse... I'm still here. But you should know that you son isn't the only one that wants you here. You are very cared for on this forum. I know this is a difficult concept because we only ever type to one another, but, the compassion that you have shown in your posts to others shows us what a fantastic person you are. Which brings me to you last point. It is a valid feeling when your feeling like you are, to believe that people will judge you harshly. We arn't. You haven't in the past, and most of the posters here on the forum know (actually know) how you are feeling. We care about you and I hope you are getting through this.
-Robin

 

[just mary]

Hi HB,

I'm truly sorry that you're going through such a tough time but I'm glad that you came here and told us about it. And I don't think you're a freak, that's one of the things this forum does, it shows that many of our feelings are shared by others, that we're not odd and we're not alone. We're all here for you HB, just like you've been here for everyone else.

One of my first suggestions would be to call someone, maybe a good friend whom you can trust and would be willing to be there for you - whenever you needed them to. (I know people like that are pretty rare but they do exist - I've known one or two.) You could also call a professional therapist or a family doctor and speak with them. I think my main point here is to just talk to someone.

What about talking with your son or a close family member? Just letting them know that you're going through a really tough time. I sometimes wish my own Mum would talk to me more about what she's feeling. Sometimes she seems so down and I would like to be able to help but she never acknowledges it - she's big into that "stiff, upper lip" thing. I just want to be there for her since she has always been there for me. I know she's human and that she feels pain too.

And I understand the feelings of guilt when you have thoughts like this, I've had them too. And I really hope I'm not saying the wrong thing but I think these feelings of guilt help us get through these low times. And once we get help and get past them, these feelings of guilt are replaced by better feelings, feelings that make us happy to be alive.

Anyway HB, thanks for posting and I hope to hear from you soon.

Take care,

 

[Rosa]

((((healthbound)))) I'm so sorry to hear that your having hard times... but I'm very glad to see your writing about. As you can see by the posts so far, people really do care and want you to be able to express yourself.
As you may know, I too feel suicidal sometimes and I don't necessarly know why other than feeling completely overwhelmed. I also know how frustrating this can be. I know it must be extra hard for you knowing that your sister killed herself and not wanting to bring up hard feelings for others, but believe me they would want to know. And if they don't want to know, we do.
The important thing is that you talk to someone who can help you sort through this. I know what its like and it hurts soooo much, but your right-your son needs you...just like my dogs have needed me.
Take care my friend and were here for you.
Lots of safe hugs
Rosa

 

[Holly]

I'm going through a tough time and I'm not sure how to best ride it out.

I feel unstable and unpredictable and that scares me. I feel angry and embarrassed that I keep returning to suicide as an option. I feel even more embarrassed to talk about it because my sister took her life and I know how upsetting the entire subject is. I also feel guilty that I would even have these thoughts/feelings/desires. I have a son who I love very much and I can't seem to make any sense about why I would even consider such a disturbing option knowing how important he and his development is to me.

I also feel very conflicted about posting this. I want to talk about it because I want to move through it, but I don't want to be a freak or have people stop being supportive of me. What I do want is to acknowledge how sad I feel and work through it without turning to such a destructive and permanent way of coping with it.

Sorry to be such a downer and thanks for reading.

Dear healthbound,
I personally think posting in the forum is important. You have feelings that you need to express. Do you think your being hard on yourself? I sometimes think I am being hard on myself, I may not even have a reason. It does bring conflict and guilt when I feel that way. I sometimes write down my feelings, find something I enjoy doing to help me remember, I have nothing to be shameful off. I am doing my best. Even if the bad day is really a downer, like a double downer if you know what I mean! I found if I had those days I would be extra kind to myself, not judging myself all the time, reflecting on something that I enjoyed made me feel better. I know I had other options, there for me to utilize. I hope this is helpful, we all find our unique ways to cope. Take care

 

[healthbound]

Talking about this must be hard for the people around you, having lost you sister. However, do you feel that there is no-one that would want to hear from you feeling like this? Perhaps if people in your family knew how you were feeling, your sisters memory would shock them into helping you as much as they could?

Ya, one would think. You've actually hit the nail on the head in terms of exactly what I think is challenging me so much right now.

My dad and his wife know I've been battling these feelings. I had a phone conversation with my dad a few weeks ago that was extremely disturbing to me. He thinks I'm a "con artist" and a "hustler". Over the past year and a half they have both suggested (more than once) that I'm "making all this up". My dad does NOT want to help me financially until my PWD or Short Term Leave kicks in again and after my telling him that I felt very sad and confused by that his response was, "Do you think you should just be able to call me up anytime you want, ask for money and I should just write a check?".

I feel very confused and extremely sad about their heavily distorted perception of me. I also believe that they probably prefere that I were dead. I'm not being mellow dramatic...I'm being sincere. That is the big component of my going through this "tough time" right now.

My challenge is to let my relationship with them go, but not accept their perception as my reality. I know in my heart that I'm a good person. I also know in my heart that I've been working hard on my depression (and other health issues). But they don't see that...they see someone they most likely needed to "make up" so that they could avoid their own reality (that I BATTLE depression and that I'm not making it up and that I am able to function normally more often than not...but when I'm not...I get debilitated. My sister already took her life, so I'm assuming they KNOW I'm not just screwing around here (ie: idle threats). I'm very serious.

The fact is my dad's wife has to believe the distortions too...otherwise how could she continue to stay committed to such a blatent jerk. If they want to live in their bubble, so be it. Now, I just have to figure out how to not let it get to me. Afterall, they are my parents and I ultimately do want them to love and accept me. Even support me.

Awk. I'm rambling. And blaming. I'm angry and horribly sad. I hate how I feel and it's hard to remember that feelings will pass. I don't feel "right" (I mean I feel like something's really wrong). I'm sure I sound like I'm in a lake of self pitty and am being really dramatic, but it seems to be where i'm at.

You may have noticed that I still feel extremely crappy. I'm really feeling challenged with this right now.

 

[Rosa]

(((healthbound))) Unfortunately, sometimes are parents are not the best for us and the best thing we can do is to accept that and go on. I know its hard, I've been there. I just don't like seeing you hurt further by their responses.
I'm still here and you can write all you want and I will be here.
In friendship
Rosa

 

[healthbound]

Thanks Rosa.

And thank you to everyone. I cried when I read all the responses.

I feel like I can't "shake it" off or something. I feel stuck.

I feel really sad and extremely uncomfortable. I would like to feel more "grounded", but I don't. I just feel extreme discomfort.

I also feel angry about even feeling like this. I don't like how I feel immobilized by it. I wish I could still "move" while feeling like this.

I started reading a book called Constructive Living a while back. I think I'll read some of it tonight. It's a book by David Reynolds who took 2 different Eastern psychologies and "westernized" them. Anyway, as far as I can tell, Constructive Living is about feeling and thinking everything, but continuing to DO anyway. So be as you are, but continue to work and/or be active. Maybe that'll help me.

Thanks again, I wish I wasn't feeling like this, but I am. I know it's a drag. I hope I "snap" out of it soon.

PS ---- I'm on 300mg of effexor...why do I still feel suicidal? Is that normal?

 

[healthbound]

Oh ya...my son is going away for 7 days. He's leaving tomorrow. I'm very nervous about this. Maybe I should go to the hospital when he's gone. That would give me an opportunity to go there without him knowing and I know I'd be "safe" from myself. Sounds rediculous that I'd even need to protect myself from myself. Stupid.

 

[ThatLady]

Let's try looking at a possibility:

You know how badly you're feeling after your sister's untimely death, healthbound. Something like that really hits you hard, and the feelings you have...the things you think and do...often aren't what you'd be feeling, thinking, or doing if such a horrific thing hadn't happened.

The same may be true for your parents. Here's why: When one's child is diagnosed with depression (by child, I mean offspring of any age) the first thing a parent does is blame him/herself. The first question that parent asks is: "Where did I go wrong?"

People deal with self-doubt and self-blame in different ways. Some will confront it head-on, and either get help or endeavor to deal with it in a proactive manner themselves. On the other hand, some people will board a boat down the river of denial. These people refuse to face the situation at all. There is no depression. There's no such thing. If my child is depressive, I've failed and that just CAN'T be. Therefore, I must believe that it's all a hoax or face my own possible culpability. There's no grey area for these people. It's all or nothing. I'm at fault or depression doesn't exist. In the case of your parents, with one child already the victim of suicide due to depression, they're rowing that boat for all they're worth...and getting nowhere. If you look at it that way, their predicament is even worse than yours.

At least, you're making sense of what's occured and working toward dealing with your feelings and making sure that you take care of your own depressive tendencies so as not to repeat your sister's sad actions. While realizing the above won't, perhaps, make it any easier, it might help you to understand what could be happening here. There's the possibility that with time, when the grief has been thoroughly dealt with and the boat can finally come to shore, your parents will be better able to deal with all that's gone on in a healthy, forward-looking way. Some make it to this point, and some don't. For you, the most important thing you must do is to take care of you. Make sure you're doing all you can for yourself, within and without. We cannot ever make someone love us. Some people cannot love. However, we can always love ourselves and work toward being the best person we can be. That, in itself, makes us loveable.

You have a right to be angry. You have a right to feel sad. The things that have happened in your life are deserving of those feelings. The important thing is, if you feel you cannot control those feelings, the hospital might not be a bad idea. You can get help there, and there will be people who can help you see the whole picture.

Whatever you decide, we're with you all the way. You have our love, our understanding, and our respect, healthbound.

 

[healthbound]

I believe the possibility you've described is, in fact, what is going on.

My cognitive mind can grasp the situation and make some sense of it while the emotional part of me is seriously struggling. Or maybe it's not even cognitive vs emotional. Maybe it's more adult vs child. I don't know. I have a difficult time accepting hime (and them). I feel really angry that I get the "brunt" of their lack of acceptance. And then I get even angrier that I allow myself to be affected by them so much.

I KNOW in my bones that I am a good person...a kind person, an intelligent person, a good mom, a funny woman etc. I KNOW that I live my life trying to "do the right thing".

Then, how come a few comments by my father or his wife seem to be able to knock me flat on my butt? I don't like that. I don't want to take on their perception of me. And I don't want to be like them either.

I'm going through the difficult process of letting go of the last immediate family member. I'm letting go of my "wish" about him and them (about how we're this happy family and that they actually care about me). It's just not so. They are who they are and I am who I am. But, let's face it...it's horribly sad to know that he doesn't actually care about me. Or that he's able to turn off all his emotions. I wish I could turn off my emotions. And I actually did for quite some time. But, it doesn't seem to work for me the same way it does for him. So be it.

I feel happy about the relationship that I have with my mom (even though it's literally ONLY through e-mail). I greatly miss my relationship with my sister. I wished for a relationship with my dad, but I can't seem to maintain my self respect becasue I can't build and maintain a hard enough shell to continue to endure the comments and blatent bullcrap. I don't want to be their scape goat. I have enough of my own problems.

But now I'm really alone and I feel pretty sad about that. And I also feel concerned about it ... knowing that I go through serious depressive periods. I'm in the process of setting things up so that when I fall/crash, I can still meet our most basic needs. But, it's not quite there yet. I just have to hold out for a while longer.

 

[ThatLady]

Your emotions are fragile right now, healthbound; therefore, they're harder to control and keep in perspective. That's completely understandable. You're still working through the process of grieving your sister's loss.

I don't think it's so much that your father doesn't care about you as that he can't seem to find a way to manage his own feelings about what's happened, so he's living in denial and shutting out any possibility of culpability on his part (as he sees it), and any possibility that you might be depressive, too. That sets him up for another loss, in his mind, and he's not ready to deal with it. Just as your emotions are in turmoil, so his are, as well.

I don't know your dad, so I can't say for sure whether he's the type that will work his way through this, or if he's one of the ones who will always be adrift. If the latter is true, you need to make your own way and realize that while he's your father, he's not you and you are not him. You can care about him without turning yourself over to him. If he and his wife can't refrain from making hurtful remarks, it's probably best to put them on a back burner for the time being and let them simmer there. They'll either become a delicious "soup", or they'll just remain a boiling mass of ugly. It's up to them. You can't make things happen for them, only for you.

You're not alone. As you said, you have a good e-mail relationship with your mother. You have us here. Most of all you have yourself and your own inner strength. This is certainly a time of concentrated strength-building. While those times are difficult, they're also rewarding in that we gain much from them...all of which becomes apparent down the road.

Getting a handle on your own depression must be your first priority. Anything that makes that more difficult must be removed from the equation until you're healthy and strong. It's not as though you're rejecting your father totally. It's just that, right now, he's a negative influence you don't need. Later on, perhaps, you'll be better able to assess the situation and see if he's a person you want in your life at all.

 

[healthbound]

Getting a handle on your own depression must be your first priority. Anything that makes that more difficult must be removed from the equation until you're healthy and strong. It's not as though you're rejecting your father totally. It's just that, right now, he's a negative influence you don't need. Later on, perhaps, you'll be better able to assess the situation and see if he's a person you want in your life at all.

I've been struggling with trying to decide how I should best handle my relationship with them. I'd acutally like to put them on the back burner for now ... until I can get back to being more objective. I know my thoughts and feelings are heavily influenced by feeling so vulnerable and therefore, I don't want to make any decisions about my relationship with them just yet. I want to be sure that I am confident about making the best decision for me, but I don't feel that confidence at all.

My dad has not tried to contact me since our phone conversation. I honestly don't know if he actually does care about me or not. I have many reasons indicating that he may simply not be capable of caring at all. But whether he does or does not...is in some ways irrelevant if I am only thinking of how to move past this depressive period right now. His wife has been calling and e-mailing. I have responded to her e-mails, but neither of us has mentioned anything about my conversation with my dad. She left 2 voice messages in the last 3 days and is sounding annoyed at me.

I feel like I've worked very hard in different ways over the past years to gain their acceptance. I don't like that they do not accept me as I am...especially since I've taken some very objective "looks" at myself and have concluded that I'm pretty ok the way I am. I'm a pretty likeable and good person. But, I do have depressive episodes. I didn't have one for a long time (about a decade). The last time I was depressed like this was after my sister died.

I tried going back to work...I couldn't do it. I can only do what I can only do. I try to "wish" myself better, but I'm at where I'm at. I have nothing to gain by being suicidally depressed. In fact I literally have everything to lose. If I knew how to stop myself from getting into this head space I would do it. I work hard on my personal development and I can only do what I can only do.

I could have chosen to do what my sister did. I could also chose to be like my mom. And I tried my dad's way, but that didn't work for me either.

I just am who I am. Many days, I'm ok with that. Actually ---- even over this past few days...I ---well, nevermind. I was going to say that I'd still rather be me than any of them...but, I don't know about that. Denial seems like a pretty sweet deal ---if one can maintain it. I am not a person who can maintain it. I try, but then I usually end up worse off because I still have to deal with whatever the issue is PLUS the after-effects of any denial-coping-tools.

Ah, here I go again. Ramble on.

At least I feel like I'm remembering that I do have some strength somewhere in me that values who I am. I think that's all I am desperately craving right now anyway. To be of value. Even if it's just to myself. I want to be of value.

Desperate and dramatic, I know. But then again, maybe I'm desperate and dramatic right now At least this is taking my focus away from death for a while.

 

[ThatLady]

I don't see it as dramatic, at all. I see it as a simple expression of feelings...of what's going on inside. Sometimes, our inner turmoils can seem overly dramatic, but...well, they're very real.

It sounds to me like you're handling this situation with great maturity, healthbound. You recognize that the fault likes not with you, but with your father at this point. That's not always easy to see yet, you have seen it. That's a lot to be said for your perceptiveness!

If your father's wifes calls are upsetting to you, don't take them. If her emails are upsetting, don't read them. If she wants to get irritated, that's her choice, not yours. You could email her and let her know that you really don't feel that communication with them is helpful to your chosen course of action at the moment, and that you will get back in touch when you feel you all have something positive to contribute to one another. Just remember that her reaction has nothing to do with you. It's her choice and hers alone.

If you can't work right now, you can't. That's how it is. Depression can put one in that shape. If we look at it right, though, we ARE working. We're working our way through the depression so we can get back to living healthy, happy lives.

 

[healthbound]

Thanks for your post, TL.

Even though I'm able to see the situation for what it really is, I still feel very intensely. That's the hard part.

How bizarre that so many different people would go to so many great lengths just to avoid certain emotions. Odd.

I was actually in the middle of writing an e-mail to his wife. I haven't taken any of her calls but I have listened to the voice messages she leaves. I am struggling with what to say in the e-mail. I don't want to go into detail. I also know that no matter how I phrase things, it'll be spun back around to me. I simply want to be honest without setting them off.

I was thinking that I could simply say:
I'm still feeling a lot of emotions about my last phone conversation with my dad and need some space until I can better figure things out. I am emotional and am having a difficult time thinking clearly right now. I just thought I'd let you know so you'd know what was going on.

They know my situation and if I try to explain that I'm in a serious depression right now and need to focus on getting out of it...I'm thinking they'll angry and blame me as that is what usually happens. And frankly, I'm sick of hearing it. It just amplifies things and makes me more upset. And I don't need ANY help in that area right now.